Back in May of 2001, culmination of our collective misdeeds Donald Trump called in to Howard Stern’s Radio Show to plug the upcoming Miss Universe competition. But when Trump learned that the day’s guest host was gossip columnist A.J. Benza (the same man whose girlfriend Trump had “stolen” several years back), what started as an innocent promotion quickly devolved into a disgusting display of dick-measuring. Donald Trump hasn’t changed a bit.

The two men spend over half an hour bickering, with particular focus on A) the timeline of each man’s relationship with former model Kara Young and B) who can embarrass the other man more. After a brief discussion of Benza’s new book, in which he apparently accuses Donald of going after his girlfriend, Trump counters with, “No, I did more. I stole his girlfriend, but I didn’t know I was stealing your girlfriend.” Adding later, “I’ve been successful with your girlfriend, I’ll tell you that. A.J., I won your girlfriend. You know it, she knows it, and everybody knows it.”

Trump continues to needle the man, asserting that he somehow “ruined” Young for Benza to the point that Benza “will never be able to go back to her.” In response, Benza starts trying to air some of Trump’s own dirty laundry, repeating (or confirming) the long-held hair plug rumors in addition to alleging Trump’s habit of sending ex-girlfriends news clippings about himself with the word “billionaire” written in Sharpie.

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It’s certainly not hard to believe. Graydon Carter, current editor of Vanity Fair and former editor of Spy magazine, recently wrote about a similar experience:

To this day, I receive the occasional envelope from Trump. There is always a photo of him—generally a tear sheet from a magazine. On all of them he has circled his hand in gold Sharpie in a valiant effort to highlight the length of his fingers.

Listening to the interview, the most alarming thing isn’t Trump’s deplorable backbiting, but rather the fact that the “political” Trump we see today has undergone no transformation whatsoever. It’s easy to replace Benza with Cruz or Rubio during any of the GOP debates. He’s simply traded one set of punching bags for another—these are simply wearing bad suits.

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And still, Donald Trump insists he’ll change when it comes time to take his rightful place in the Oval Office, recently telling Fox New’s Greta Van Susteren, “As I get closer and closer to the goal, it’s going to get different... I’m very capable of changing to anything I want to change to.”

We’re waiting, Donald.


Contact the author at ashley@gawker.com.