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rdVark
11/23/09

In reply to This Thanksgiving, Remember Meat Is Murder
Oh man, these all-or-nothing attitudes that require perfection from vegans and vegetarians are nothing but justifications for other people because they don't want to change any of their own ways. No one is perfect, and requiring everyone to either go one way (carnivore, fur-wearing, puppy-stomping) or the other (vegan, non-sitter on leather couch, non-pet owner, etc) just perpetuates lifestyles of extremism that belittle any kind of moderation of our lifestyles. Vegans and vegetarians aren't perfect, and requiring them to be just means you are afraid of any change of your lifestyle, however small. Because if it isn`t all-or-nothing then you might have to give up that extra serving of factory farmed beef you had at lunch today. That goes for both meat-eaters and vegans alike.

Sorry if this was offensive, but I can`t say that I wasn't offended by most of the comments below.
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squeakel
11/23/09

In reply to This Thanksgiving, Remember Meat Is Murder
The worst thing about vegans is that they're mostly right.
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Fry_Bread_Power
11/23/09

@squeakel: Yes, vegans are mostly right, which brings me to the main point about people who like eating meat: they don't care.
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Atilla the Bun
11/24/09

@Fry_Bread_Power: Then why do some of them flip out so much over a relatively obscure book, newspaper article or tv commercial? i don't think that vegans are necessarily "mostly right." It's a complicated issue. But if anything convinces me that maybe vegans and vegetarians have point is how flipped-out some people on the other side of the issue get over these things in a "fuck you! I'm going to eat baby bunnies now just cuz!" kind of way.
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Edited by Atilla the Bun at 11/24/09 12:49 AM Atilla the Bun was starred Atilla the Bun was unstarred

Fry_Bread_Power
11/24/09

@Atilla the Bun: But like you said, those are some people, not all and not even most. And one can't really argue that vegans/vegetarians have a point based on some other people's over-reaction. Would you also agree that Tea-baggers have a point because look how flipped-out some people on the other side of the issue get whenever there is something about them in the news? Please.

There are several reasons why the meat industry is still a billion-dollar industry even though groups like PETA and those who promote vegan/vegetarian lifestyles raise awareness on how meat is processed on a corporate scale. One reason is people who like eating meat...like eating meat. And no amount of PETA commercials will change that.
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Charolastra
11/23/09

In reply to This Thanksgiving, Remember Meat Is Murder
Ugh, there are few things I hate as much as PETA. You *can't* call killing an animal murder. Murder is an action that not only describes the death of a human being at the hands of another, but also carries the connotation of the violation of one of the basic tenants of the social contract: when a society tolerates violent action it endangers the rule of law and consequently its whole existence. If you were to extend the definition of murder to cover animals, well I suppose we better get those chimpanzees through law school so they can start prosecuting all those rampant, unsolved murders that occur daily in the natural world. That's an idea I hope Jerry Bruckheimer never gets a hold of, because I could not stomach a Monkey CSI.

Really, the dumbest thing about PETA's argument is that it implies that if it weren't for humans, the noble inhabitants of the animal kingdom would live in a peace that only exists in Disney movies. In order to have harmonious ecosystems, a whole lot of killing has to happen. Otherwise, populations grow out of control and deplete resources until they leave the land barren (see the Nile Perch in Lake Victoria, Deers in National Parks with non-existent wolf populations, etc.)

The most reasonable argument for vegetarianism I've heard is that the meat industry consumes an exorbitant amount of resources and leaves a tremendous carbon footprint, endangering the survival of life in our planet. Now, that's something I can get behind.

(Also, I do not intend to discredit people's personal attachment to animals and their particular refusal to inflict unnecessary cruelty on other living beings. However, while you should be free to raise awareness of what goes on behind producing a leather garment, you have no right to attack or vilify those who do not share your stance towards animal cruelty.)
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Mrs. Beeton
11/23/09

In reply to This Thanksgiving, Remember Meat Is Murder
How many animals had to die to build the computer he surely composed his op-ed on? Two? Eleven? Twenty-three million? Is typewriter ink squeezed from baby squids? Are bacterium rended to pieces if you write with your own shit on the walls of Boston Market? Being a vegan must be complicated.
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AzureTexan
11/23/09

In reply to This Thanksgiving, Remember Meat Is Murder
"And thank you for reminding us, oh Lord, that on this most blessed of Thursdays we celebrate the triumphant arrival of the Donner Party at bountiful Plymouth Rock."
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HenryLovesFonzie
11/23/09

In reply to This Thanksgiving, Remember Meat Is Murder
"We gather together
for yams, beans, and cranberry sauce.
But have you given much thought lately
to the Turkey Holocaust?
Twenty million noble birds
slaughtered every fall.
Ain’t no difference between Hitler, Stalin
and the folks at Butterball!
Butterba-a-a-a-ll!!
So set your tables, America
from Birmingham to Branson.
But when you carve that turkey
you’re a finger-licking Charlie Manson.
Enjoy your pumpkin pie
your buttery Idaho spud.
Grandma’s chestnut stuffing
and a turkey basted in blood!
Basted in blood! Basted in blood!
Basted in blood! Basted in blood!
Basted in blood! Basted in blood!
Basted in blood! Basted in blood!"
- Sarah McLachlan & Ana Gasteyer, SNL
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Edited by HenryLovesFonzie at 11/23/09 4:56 PM HenryLovesFonzie was starred HenryLovesFonzie was unstarred

boobookitt
11/23/09

In reply to This Thanksgiving, Remember Meat Is Murder
I've been vegetarian for 15 years and every time PETA opens their collective fat stupid mouth I want to eat a live baby lamb on their doorstep.
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nellicat
11/23/09

In reply to This Thanksgiving, Remember Meat Is Murder
My favorite part of the op-ed was when he noted that your precious free-range turkey has absolutely nothing to be thankful for. So think about THAT, you cold, selfish motherfuckers.
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Botswana Meat Commission FC
11/23/09

In reply to This Thanksgiving, Remember Meat Is Murder
Vegans are the best thing that ever happened to vegetarians.
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naugahydeinplainsight
11/23/09

In reply to This Thanksgiving, Remember Meat Is Murder
rainbows . . . and unicorns! Thank you for unicorns, roasted with chestnut stuffing.
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AndPreciousLittleofThat
11/23/09

In reply to This Thanksgiving, Remember Meat Is Murder
This year when I'm at the Thanksgiving table, I'll be sure to have my guests take a moment of silence so we can all think about how we're participating in an ongoing holocaust of our fellow less-than-human creatures. Sure.

Peter Singer clearly learned from the "my Catholic grandmother" school of guilt-tripping.
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TheRtHonPM
11/23/09

In reply to This Thanksgiving, Remember Meat Is Murder
I read that NYT op-ed. The most awesome part about it? Turns out the author has a cat.

There's nothing funnier than a militant vegan who owns possibly the most perfectly adapted predator that evolution has ever produced. Except maybe when said vegan tries to feed the cat a diet of soybeans, while arguing about the dignity of animals.
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Atilla the Bun
11/23/09

@TheRtHonPM: I'm a vegan with a cat, and yes my cat eats catfood with all kinds of dead critters in it. Of course, I'm not a cat and don't have to eat meat to stay alive, so I don't really see the hypocrisy there.
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TheRtHonPM
11/23/09

@Atilla the Bun: But wouldn't it be better not to own the cat in the first place?
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Atilla the Bun
11/23/09

@TheRtHonPM: Better for what? Probably not my cat.

I don't know why some people have this all or nothing attitude about vegenism. Like if anything I do, from driving a car to owning a cat, contributes to the death of another living thing then I should just give the whole thing up and go around eating entire bovines for lunch.
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SarahHeartburn
11/23/09

In reply to This Thanksgiving, Remember Meat Is Murder
Next year just roast the kid.
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naugahydeinplainsight
11/23/09

@SarahHeartburn: Why wait? She's fresh.
And for that extra-special evening, this year combine dinner with a movie. May I suggest The Road?
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Go Like Hell Machine
11/23/09

@naugahydeinplainsight: Add booze and you have my Thanksgiving plans, in a nutshell.
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momof3wildkids
11/23/09

In reply to This Thanksgiving, Remember Meat Is Murder

This omnivore will no consider eating Tofurkey on Thanksgiving or any other day of year. This is what Momof3 will be serving on Thursday. From the periodical Bacon Today, Turbaconducken: [bacontoday.com]
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fuckingoldman
11/23/09

@momof3wildkids: Can my wife and I come for dinner? I have never seen a more delicious looking bird. Mmmm, bacon. The meat that makes all other meat taste better!
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momof3wildkids
11/23/09

@fuckingoldman: There is no better garnish for meat than meat.
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Go Like Hell Machine
11/23/09

@momof3wildkids: That looks obscenely, amazingly fantastic. You had better be fucking deep-frying it, though.
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momof3wildkids
11/23/09

@Go Like Hell Machine: I am first cooking it in the oven to get a bit of drippings for gravy (ah, baconish gravy)... then that bird hits the fryer.
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Mediahohoho
11/23/09

In reply to This Thanksgiving, Remember Meat Is Murder
Thanks most of all for the gift of smugness.
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