How about this... he's a Muslim. He's a terrorist. He said lots of anti-American things and then snapped and killed a bunch of people while shouting 'Allah Ackbar'.
@Han Valen: Agreed. By not simply acknowledging this, we sound like the crazy right-wing nut jobs who insist that the murdered census worker who had the word "FED" carved in his chest may have been killed for reasons other than anti-government sentiment. #nidalmalikhasan
Let's be thankful that Hasan survived so he can settle this bullshit for once and all. The worst thing that could've happened was if he had died and we'd be left with wackos like Lieberman to put words in his mouth or use his image to sell some freakish agenda (see: Pat Tillman)
I think the truth is that Hasan was a very incompetent and dissolusioned soldier turned wannabe radical Islamist. If this guy is the boogieman, then a real terrorist like Scott Roeder is Godzilla, Freddie, and Jason rolled up in to one. Only no one's talking about him. #nidalmalikhasan
@pepelicious: Right. We should believe the guy who just murdered 12 unarmed soldiers and a civilian, rather than Joe Lieberman. Because Lieberman's not liberal. #nidalmalikhasan
@pepelicious: Who gives a flying fig what this man has to say? And are you attempting to say that the murder of 13 people is somehow less significant or horrifying than the murder of an abortion doctor, because it had nothing to do with an issue that is important to you? #nidalmalikhasan
@pepelicious: You're assuming that he's going to talk.
As for his radicalization, he was attending that mosque (the same one attended by 2 of the 9/11 terrorists and run by a radical, terrorism-supporting imam) before 9/11.
@pooks: I'm just curious what he has to say for himself. I'm not saying that he deserves to be heard, but everyone and their mother are grabbing at bits of clues to figure out his motives. I don't think he's this evil genius who had some master plan he devised with Al Qaeda like some in the media are making him out to be. In a way, that's giving him way more credit than he deserves. Odds are he'll talk and reveal himself to be a mentally unstable loser who couldn't even get Al Qaeda to support him. #nidalmalikhasan
@no I said no I won't no: What did Joe Lieberman know about this guy when he made his comments? Probably not much more than we did at the time. He saw an opportunity to get his name out there on a slam dunk issue.
Tell me who's profiting off the tragedy at Fort Hood? #nidalmalikhasan
@no I said no I won't no: Really? Lieberman is the first person to turn to when a national tragedy happens, I guess. He's got it all worked out.
Barring actual facts, it's all hearsay. Lieberman based his initial conclusion on statements Hasan allegedly made, saying that was enough to brand him a Islamist extremist, i.e. a terrorist on par with Al Qaeda. Even the Army Chief of Staff warned that it wasn't a good idea to start "connecting the dots" so early on.
Lieberman is a callous opportunist, looking for any issue to prop him up in the public eye. Do you think he cared about the broader implications of his allegations? He's not in the Middle East fighting in a war - perhaps there was a reason the Army was concerned about such grandiose statements. Did Lieberman care? No. All he saw was the opportunity to be the first one to scream, "Terrorist!".
The only silver lining to Gore losing in 2000 was that we were spared at least 4 years of Lieberman in the White House. #nidalmalikhasan
@Niko Bellic: I truly hope that's how, in the end, he's portrayed. Those who would call Republican or Democratic Senators "Traitors" because they vote for a damn health care bill need to be reminded of the utter seriousness of the term, and need to have pointed out to them that it's a pretty specific and harsh term designed for, oh, someone in uniform who turns a military base into a shooting gallery.
notsofresh promoted this comment
Edited by Go Like Hell Machine at 11/09/09 3:54 PM
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@Fuzzy Dunlop: I did not say they are exclusive, but I don't think he is a terrorist, and here is why:
If this has happened in a base in a foreign country, than you could argue that his motivation was to inflict terror on the US public. But, if that was his motivation, and he was in US, wouldn't it be more effective to hit a school, or a mall or something?
I think his target was (at least in his mind) a military one. So, I think it's a classic case of treason: he had conflicting loyalties, and he finally picked the other side.
@Niko Bellic: There is no universally-accepted definition of "terrorism." But I would think the fact that he tried to contact a terrorist organization beforehand, and attacked unarmed people outside of a combat zone, would be enough for the colloquial use of the term. Quibbling over how to define "terrorist" in this circumstance is just that, quibbling, and I don't understand why it's necessary here. To be honest, it makes our side look like a bunch of fucking smarter-than-thou jackasses. "Oh no, the man who slaughtered all those people wasn't a terrorist you silly red-staters. Let me explain why over a nice Merlot." #nidalmalikhasan
@Fuzzy Dunlop: Well, but seriously, if this can be construed as "terrorism"; an attack on actual state actors by a single rogue individual with, what sounds like, a fairly loose set of objectives, then we're defining terrorism really loosely. Isn't there usually some sort of will to influence political decisions, at least to a degree?
I mean, I know that Islamic fundamentalism is nihilistic, but this seems much more so than even that. Even OBL wanted to influence the US Government, even if he wasn't sure exactly how the US would respond. It doesn't sound like this guy had an objective beyond killing a bunch of military service persons. #nidalmalikhasan
@Go Like Hell Machine: I'd say you're imposing too stringent a requirement if you say that there needs to be some express will to influence specific political decisions in order to qualify as terrorism. Richard Reid, the shoe bomber, was certainly a terrorist, but I doubt that nutjob could articulate specific political positions beyond "die, infidels!" In any case, I think the "political motivation" prong is pretty strong here - he didn't want US troops to be deployed to the Middle East, so he killed people on an army base from which US troops were to be deployed to the Middle East.
Again, maybe there's an esoteric argument that no crime against military personnel should be considered "terrorism" under any circumstances, but my main point is why the hell do we want to have that argument, now or ever? It's just a really dumb time to be arguing over semantics. It makes liberals look like disconnected boobs, and it achieves no purpose. #nidalmalikhasan
@Fuzzy Dunlop: I can sympathize, but also, respectfully disagree. I think that the difference in terminology is important and profound, and we'd be better off having an esoteric discussion on the meaning of "terrorism" now, rather than defining it as we see it, which, historically hasn't worked very well when trying to apply standards of rule of law. #nidalmalikhasan
If you look into it, you'll find that he was given the inhaled version h1n1 vaccine, which actually vectors nanobots into close proximity to the brain. Once they reach their objective, the medulla non grata, they go into hibernation until their host receives a telefon call from Dick Cheney. #nidalmalikhasan
@Uncle_Billy_Slumming: Wow, a blogpost on a hot political topic and it is clear-eyed and reasonable! You will never work in the MSM, Mr. Cook. #nidalmalikhasan
And when Scott Roeder kills a doctor, it's not because of his "extremist Christian beliefs," it's because he's either extremely pro-life or because he's a "concerned citizen." Balls. #nidalmalikhasan
I wish the network news dinks would really assert the fact the biggest enemy we face in the U.S. are loons inside of the U.S.
Anti-Obama folks hoarding guns and ammo and showing up at rallies with assault rifles? Now this?
Also, everything points to this guy being a known problem who was shuffled around by his supervisors. When he should have been kicked out of the military to begin with.
It's seems like only yesterday (actually, it was Monday) that Virginia Foxx R-NC was telling me that I had less to fear from Islamic terrorists than from the Democrats' healthcare bill. At this point in the week, is that still an acceptable statement? Perhaps she'd feel differently if Ft. Hood were in her district. Or if she had a soul.
I'm not sure why this has to be something that joins the long list of things liberals and conservatives fight over. It sucks when people kill for religion. It sucks when people kill because they can't get laid. It sucks when people kill because they get picked on at school. It sucks when people kill because they feel socially ostracized. It sucks when people kill so they can get their picture on the news. It sucks when people kill because their boss made them work overtime. It sucks when people kill because a TV host told them the government was going to take away their guns. It sucks when people kill because the IRS is unconstitutional blah blah fucking blah.
To me, I'm bored senseless by the "why" of the nihilistic disregard for human life displayed by all these fuckers, the absolute narcissism of thinking your "reasons" trump anyone else's right to continue living. Fuck no.
Muhammad told you to kill your fellow soldiers? Fuck him. Jesus wanted you to invade a country and take out a few hundred thousand civilians? Fuck him. Lord Krishna order you to torch that mosque and take back your temple? Fuck him and fuck your temple. Fuck your mosque, your church, your synagogue, your scripture, your holy places and your heritage. Fuck your cause.
Because if this is the service your God asks of you, your God is an asshole.
@Mediahohoho: Yours is an entertaining rant, but devoid of any legit intellectual value. Empty calories, like gulping down a soda that feels satisfying in the moment but has zero nutritional value. You're bulldozing over the complex meaning and purpose of religious affiliation with a storm of F words. I'm not sure how this makes us smarter, not Fox News-dumber, but whatever. #nidalmalikhasan
@snugbug: "You're bulldozing over the complex meaning and purpose of religious affiliation with a storm of F words."
That's not at all what she's doing. If killing isn't a service your god asks of you then your god isn't an asshole!
But, arguably, it's not your god but you whose the asshole in that equation, right? So god's off the hook! Unless even the good gods are as much a projection of their believers as the bad ones--something that does go toward understanding the complexities of religious affiliation, but not one that the religiously affiliated would appreciate. Too bad. #nidalmalikhasan
@Mediahohoho: I don't think your rant is "devoid of any legit intellectual value". It is making a great point, of being tired of hearing about the Whys of murder, as if there is a philosophical/religious excuse for randomly killing strangers/coworkers/passersby/etc. No need for a sympathetic psychological/sociological history of major religions to make the point. Maybe part of the problem is that organized religion gets far too much sympathy. #nidalmalikhasan
@Bulkington: Very good. Exactly. God is never the problem; man/womankind is. We invented God and then proceeded to put words into his mouth. I realize this last statement doesn't make much logical sense--you need to read it as a koan of some sort. I specialize in koans, you see. #nidalmalikhasan
@Bulkington: What the fuck are you people even talking about? Who are you saying this to? It astounds me that what amounts to little more than a quasi-poem scrawled in the margins of a Psychopathic Records notebook could be called a "comment of the century." So you've demonstrated that you can be despondent about shit. Awesome. Let's pat ourselves on the back some more. We've done a great job here.
It's bullshit like this that makes embarrassed to be an atheist, sometimes. But then, there are short-sighted nitwits in every group that reflect badly on the whole, amirite?
Anyway, the serious point to make is, it's monumentally stupid to boil down something like this to simple religion. It's never that simple. The foulest thing about this whole mess is that no one will learn from it. Islamic nationalism / militarism has little to nothing to do with Islam, and everything to do with elements of regional cultures violently resisting western encroachment. The idea of a global network of religious extremist only kind of came into reality after 9/11, when the Bush Administration became the proverbial bull in the china shop of the Middle East. The seeds of it were sewn long before that, in Cold War politicking and CIA meddling, in the side effects of American economic imperialism. This is all international politics.
"Al Qaeda" didn't spring from whole cloth. They were a locally-focused group who, after failing as a popular movement (fancy that, a bunch of devout muslims not deciding democratically to submit to ultraconservatives!) decided they'd use violence against their regional states, and ultimately came to the (probably accurate) conclusion that they would never come to power with Western nations involved in local events.
But the point is, it's kind of ridiculous and typical of lazy atheists to think that a person just picks up a holy book and becomes a violent warrior of faith. Yes, there is history behind it. Yes, there is sociology behind it. There's got to be an explanation why there are some muslims who never murder anyone and some who have the desire to murder everyone. It's grotesque and dishonest to paint them with the same brush.
What if we find out that this particular murderer was not part of a terrorist cell, but acted on his own spontaneously? It would make more sense to assume that there was something about his job, something about the war that pushed him irrevocably to the edge. But that's too difficult to think about, isn't it? Best to just sever that Gordian Knot. What's the worst that can happen? Yeah, fuck this nebulously defined group of astounding breadth. Punk rock!
@snugbug: @John Thompson: You both pretty much missed the point of everything I was saying. But you seem pretty satisfied with yourselves so enjoy. #nidalmalikhasan
@Mediahohoho: Oh no, I didn't miss it. You're angered by religiously inspired violence. We (well, at least I) was just reacting to the fact that you seem to have condemned entire religions & their base on account of the actions of a handful of cuckoo fringe lunatics that identified themselves as followers. Fair? Also, I'm never satisfied. Never, ever. Gimme more! #nidalmalikhasan
@snugbug: I really don't think that Mediahohoho condemned entire groups of religious people, only the mouthpieces of religion (fuck Muhammad, fuck Jesus, fuck Vishnu, not fuck Muslims, fuck Christians, fuck Hindus), and more importantly, s/he put it in the form of a conditional: IF your god tells you to kill, then fuck your god. S/he never said that "obviously the bible/koran/rig veda/norse sagas/dianetics led xyz to kill a bunch of people" #nidalmalikhasan
@snugbug: No, it was more in the line of stating my opinion that neither religion nor any of the other aforementioned reasons ascribed to mass murderers matter, are cogent or need to be dwelt upon by as serious elements of thoughtful discourse. I thought it was obvious.
For the record, my problem with religions has everything to do with their hijackers, the fundamentalists, who use these dogmas for their own selfish, narcissistic purposes. I think most people in all religions couldn't really give a shit, go through the motions and are embarrassed by their co-religionists' misuse of their various dogmas.
And I reiterate my opinion that anyone who undertakes the murder of unsuspecting, unarmed people really doesn't have an excuse grounded in any wothwhile philosophical or metaphysical paradigm because it is, by definition, an act of insanity. To me, Charles Whitman, Tim McVeigh and this prick have nothing to say to me because they're all just nuts.
But again, I'm not here to harsh on anyone who gets off on feeling intellectually superior to me. It's the least I can do, right? #nidalmalikhasan
So if the guy shooting up Orlando right now turns out to be a Christian, can that be used as a rallying cry to disenfranchise all Christian men from mainstream America? If only people realized how friggin similar all the three Abrahamic faiths are, this would really be a moot point by now. #nidalmalikhasan
I recall here in Salt Lake the time after a young Bosnian man went on a shooting spree in a local mall, killing several people and injuring others. He was muslim, and it didn't take long before people were crying for his connections to radical Islam to be investigated. Turned out there was nothing at all to that idea, and fortunately local law enforcement made that very clear. That said, he was a white kid (which was in itself apparently mind-blowing for people around here - a muslim that looks exactly like your kid?? Impossible!). I'm sure if had not been a white kid from a European country people would not have been quite so willing to let that side of the story go, despite a total lack of evidence that that was a factor. #nidalmalikhasan
11/09/09
Geezus fuck, this line of Fort Hood stories on Gawker is weak. #nidalmalikhasan
11/09/09
How about this... he's a Muslim. He's a terrorist. He said lots of anti-American things and then snapped and killed a bunch of people while shouting 'Allah Ackbar'.
Yep, he's a 'Muslim Terrorist'. Case closed. #nidalmalikhasan
11/09/09
11/09/09
I think the truth is that Hasan was a very incompetent and dissolusioned soldier turned wannabe radical Islamist. If this guy is the boogieman, then a real terrorist like Scott Roeder is Godzilla, Freddie, and Jason rolled up in to one. Only no one's talking about him. #nidalmalikhasan
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As for his radicalization, he was attending that mosque (the same one attended by 2 of the 9/11 terrorists and run by a radical, terrorism-supporting imam) before 9/11.
Also, according to ABC News, he tried to contact some people in al qaeda. [www.abcnews.go.com] #nidalmalikhasan
11/10/09
11/10/09
Tell me who's profiting off the tragedy at Fort Hood? #nidalmalikhasan
11/10/09
11/10/09
Barring actual facts, it's all hearsay. Lieberman based his initial conclusion on statements Hasan allegedly made, saying that was enough to brand him a Islamist extremist, i.e. a terrorist on par with Al Qaeda. Even the Army Chief of Staff warned that it wasn't a good idea to start "connecting the dots" so early on.
Lieberman is a callous opportunist, looking for any issue to prop him up in the public eye. Do you think he cared about the broader implications of his allegations? He's not in the Middle East fighting in a war - perhaps there was a reason the Army was concerned about such grandiose statements. Did Lieberman care? No. All he saw was the opportunity to be the first one to scream, "Terrorist!".
The only silver lining to Gore losing in 2000 was that we were spared at least 4 years of Lieberman in the White House. #nidalmalikhasan
11/09/09
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If this has happened in a base in a foreign country, than you could argue that his motivation was to inflict terror on the US public. But, if that was his motivation, and he was in US, wouldn't it be more effective to hit a school, or a mall or something?
I think his target was (at least in his mind) a military one. So, I think it's a classic case of treason: he had conflicting loyalties, and he finally picked the other side.
11/09/09
11/09/09
I mean, I know that Islamic fundamentalism is nihilistic, but this seems much more so than even that. Even OBL wanted to influence the US Government, even if he wasn't sure exactly how the US would respond. It doesn't sound like this guy had an objective beyond killing a bunch of military service persons. #nidalmalikhasan
11/09/09
Again, maybe there's an esoteric argument that no crime against military personnel should be considered "terrorism" under any circumstances, but my main point is why the hell do we want to have that argument, now or ever? It's just a really dumb time to be arguing over semantics. It makes liberals look like disconnected boobs, and it achieves no purpose. #nidalmalikhasan
11/09/09
Merlot? I discuss things over Pino. Merlot is for when it comes to breaking bottles over heads. Pfff...
Having said that: I respectfully disagree that you and I should dumb down our conversations so that we wouldn't offend the dumb. #nidalmalikhasan
11/09/09
11/09/09
I've noticed that those two groups are often in agreement #nidalmalikhasan
11/09/09
11/09/09
11/07/09
11/07/09
Anti-Obama folks hoarding guns and ammo and showing up at rallies with assault rifles? Now this?
Also, everything points to this guy being a known problem who was shuffled around by his supervisors. When he should have been kicked out of the military to begin with.
Good lord. What a mess. #nidalmalikhasan
11/07/09
11/06/09
11/06/09
11/06/09
To me, I'm bored senseless by the "why" of the nihilistic disregard for human life displayed by all these fuckers, the absolute narcissism of thinking your "reasons" trump anyone else's right to continue living. Fuck no.
Muhammad told you to kill your fellow soldiers? Fuck him. Jesus wanted you to invade a country and take out a few hundred thousand civilians? Fuck him. Lord Krishna order you to torch that mosque and take back your temple? Fuck him and fuck your temple. Fuck your mosque, your church, your synagogue, your scripture, your holy places and your heritage. Fuck your cause.
Because if this is the service your God asks of you, your God is an asshole.
11/06/09
11/06/09
11/06/09
11/06/09
11/06/09
11/06/09
That's not at all what she's doing. If killing isn't a service your god asks of you then your god isn't an asshole!
But, arguably, it's not your god but you whose the asshole in that equation, right? So god's off the hook! Unless even the good gods are as much a projection of their believers as the bad ones--something that does go toward understanding the complexities of religious affiliation, but not one that the religiously affiliated would appreciate. Too bad. #nidalmalikhasan
11/06/09
11/06/09
And I concur. #nidalmalikhasan
11/06/09
Hmmmm....how about man made god long ago out of ignorance and fear?? #nidalmalikhasan
11/06/09
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11/06/09
It's bullshit like this that makes embarrassed to be an atheist, sometimes. But then, there are short-sighted nitwits in every group that reflect badly on the whole, amirite?
Anyway, the serious point to make is, it's monumentally stupid to boil down something like this to simple religion. It's never that simple. The foulest thing about this whole mess is that no one will learn from it. Islamic nationalism / militarism has little to nothing to do with Islam, and everything to do with elements of regional cultures violently resisting western encroachment. The idea of a global network of religious extremist only kind of came into reality after 9/11, when the Bush Administration became the proverbial bull in the china shop of the Middle East. The seeds of it were sewn long before that, in Cold War politicking and CIA meddling, in the side effects of American economic imperialism. This is all international politics.
"Al Qaeda" didn't spring from whole cloth. They were a locally-focused group who, after failing as a popular movement (fancy that, a bunch of devout muslims not deciding democratically to submit to ultraconservatives!) decided they'd use violence against their regional states, and ultimately came to the (probably accurate) conclusion that they would never come to power with Western nations involved in local events.
But the point is, it's kind of ridiculous and typical of lazy atheists to think that a person just picks up a holy book and becomes a violent warrior of faith. Yes, there is history behind it. Yes, there is sociology behind it. There's got to be an explanation why there are some muslims who never murder anyone and some who have the desire to murder everyone. It's grotesque and dishonest to paint them with the same brush.
What if we find out that this particular murderer was not part of a terrorist cell, but acted on his own spontaneously? It would make more sense to assume that there was something about his job, something about the war that pushed him irrevocably to the edge. But that's too difficult to think about, isn't it? Best to just sever that Gordian Knot. What's the worst that can happen? Yeah, fuck this nebulously defined group of astounding breadth. Punk rock!
11/06/09
11/06/09
11/06/09
11/06/09
11/06/09
11/06/09
11/06/09
For the record, my problem with religions has everything to do with their hijackers, the fundamentalists, who use these dogmas for their own selfish, narcissistic purposes. I think most people in all religions couldn't really give a shit, go through the motions and are embarrassed by their co-religionists' misuse of their various dogmas.
And I reiterate my opinion that anyone who undertakes the murder of unsuspecting, unarmed people really doesn't have an excuse grounded in any wothwhile philosophical or metaphysical paradigm because it is, by definition, an act of insanity. To me, Charles Whitman, Tim McVeigh and this prick have nothing to say to me because they're all just nuts.
But again, I'm not here to harsh on anyone who gets off on feeling intellectually superior to me. It's the least I can do, right? #nidalmalikhasan
11/06/09
11/09/09
11/06/09
11/06/09
11/06/09