Somehow he managed to give southern justice a bad name. But I don't think it's quite right to call this idiot a judge. From what I can tell, justices of the peace have significantly limited powers by comparison. [www.courtreference.com]
Meanwhile, Maine won't let gays get married, either. Maybe voters there should all resign. What a country! #racism
@Claire Buoyant: My emphasis was on the word "nearly," which suggests that there are other government officials out there who supported his behavior. Should've used italics.
Jesus Christ, I am sick of opining from people who are too lazy to use the freaking Internet, which is right at their chubby little fingertips, to actually acquaint themselves with the copious amount of documented evidence that is readily available about this case before making ex cathedra pronouncements about it.
The Smoking Gun, motherfucker, do you speak it? Search on "Polanski", get a clue, and STFU.
@Oryx Hearts Crake: He could either be in Pöschwies or in the Kolonie Ringwil -- though the latter is an open institution, for people who aren't deemed to be flight risks.
Here's a picture of Pöschwies, where they might be holding him.
@i'm a bottle: That prison cell looks like my dorm room in college. Hopefully they don't use the same crappy Ikea furniture I bought. The bookshelves kept toppling over and almost killed me.
@Oryx Hearts Crake: It's larger than my dorm room and it doesn't come with an awkward kid with bad skin playing Blue Suede's "Can't Stop this Feeling" constantly.
Give it up SnugBug. A guilty plea is both the moral and the legal equivalent of a conviction. Tah-mah-toes, Tah-may-toes its still a red fruit used in pasta sauces.
@Anrkist: He plead guilty. He fled before being sentenced, i.e. "convicted." I'm a little alarmed that so many of us are still unclear on how the US justice system works. I'm not saying Polanski doesn't deserve to be locked up. Just that in strict legal terms, he has not yet been convicted of anything. It would be irresponsible to claim otherwise. It could expose a media outlet to libel.
@snugbug: A guilty plea, once entered, is a conviction. Or at least that's how I understand it, having tried several major criminal trials. I'm a little alarmed that so many of us are still unclear on how the US justice system works. I'm saying that Polanski deserves to be locked up. Just that in strict legal terms, he was convicted of anally raping an unconscious child. It would be irresponsible to claim otherwise. It could expose an uninformed blog commenter to libel.
@Crazytree: Say WHAT? A guilty plea is absolutely no binding legal agreement unless a judge acknowledges it as such and goes along with it. Am I insane?
@snugbug: "Once entered". That would be the part where the judge acknowledges it. As in this transcript, here, of the proceedings. You may not be insane, but you're not well informed. Polanski's plea was entered. The only part left was the sentencing.
How much is this business going to cost the broke state of California? They are already trying to get rid of people from their wildly over stuffed jails to save cash. I get that the allegations were serious, but the charge is the less serious sex with someone underage, Polanski isn't at large in America, and hasn't been charged in other jurisdictions in the intervening 30 years.
Despite the serious allegations in this case, I think there is some sort of agenda in the US justice system about making examples public figures associated with rebellion. The entrapment of Tommy Chong and in court arguments to use his movies as a justification to come down hard on him was creepy and ridiculous. The extradition and imprisonment of Canadian pot advocate Marc Emory is a dumb effort too.
@mostlymartian: I think you're talking apples and oranges. Tommy Chong and Marc Emory are non-violent "offenders." Their "offenses" are against laws that no one excepting the federal gov't and overzealous local authorities could give a shit about. They are victimless. The cases the gov't had against them WERE creepy, dumb and ridiculous.
Polanski is an admitted pedophile/sexual offender, for which there WAS a victim and justifiable outrage. In this case, I for one am happy that an example is being made out of him, the same way they did with Phil Spector and Michael Vick.
@Senator Sully: Polanski has always denied the violent aspect. The other charges were dropped and he only plead guilty to underage sex, so in essense it is an under age sex case.
Paired with the other cases it just seems to me that in recent times there is a vendetta against high profile counter culture types and a use of resources disproportionate the the threat they represent to the American public. It's not as though America doesn't have significant crime issues, is this the best resource allocation in terms of protecting society?
@mostlymartian: Your comment is TOTALLY off the mark. The ONLY reason Polanski was permitted to plead guilty to the lesser charge of statutory rape is because the victim would have to testify under cross examination if the district attorney had brought the more serious charges.
@mostlymartian: You know, I could give a rat's ass about what Polanski denies. He forced himself on a 13-year-old girl who pleaded with him to stop, even despite his having drugged her. That's an assault.
@Oryx Hearts Crake: I didn't say that I believed Polanski that the complainant was a willing party to the sex. What I was saying was that, regardless of the reasoning, the charge kept by the state and plead guilty to by Polanski was only the statutory rape one. Therefore in the eyes of the law and for the purposes of pursuit considerations he is only held to be a statutory rapist.
I have big doubts that broke ass California would be fighting for the extradition of a guy who fled the country 30 years ago after pleading guilty for a statutory rape charge if it was just a regular guy. A crime is a crime and Polanski plead guilty, but I really have to wonder about the amount of money and resources being put into these efforts to drag famous old guys out of other countries to jail them in the US. Was there a pressing need to make an example of him? It seems like most Americans had forgotten about the whole thing a long time ago.
@MissNormaDesmond: She gave testimony that she pleaded with him to stop. He has denied that. She was not cross examined, the case was not tried, and all charges were dropped except for under age sex. Maybe all the details of her testimony were the truth or maybe they weren't. We have two different accounts and no legal determination on any of it except that under age sex occurred.
Normally the public are pretty careful about not personally convicting an accused for things a court has not convicted them of, but somehow in this case that has been totally thrown out the window.
@mostlymartian: Her testimony has remained consistent over the course of 30 years. She had no motivation to lie; if she were being dishonest, she would have had more to gain by blackmailing Polanski than going to the police. Her account and her behavior have been completely consistent throughout the ordeal through which she was put by Polanski at the age of 13. Normally the public aren't very careful about blaming the victim for the acts of their attackers, but you're hitting a new low here. Congratulations. #romanpolanski
so, let's see. the guy lost his mother to the Holocaust, survived a Polish ghetto, and lost his wife to a murderous cult. yeah, what he did was despicable. but he's been through an awful lot. why the sudden vigilance now, thirty years later? concern for justice? more likely somebody who has a more personally directed agenda with its own selfish motives. it's real easy to pass judgement from afar, it's something we do for craven sport in America. but the more selfrighteously somebody points the finger, the more relentlessly they put somebody else under scrutiny, the more I want to poke around in their closets for awhile, because their projected anger reeks of guilt. and I guarantee, every one of you village tar and featherers, every one of you latter day witchhunters, you have skeletons, you have regrets, you have malevolent, hurtful, cringeworthy past actions you're in denial about. have you transcended them? probably not. otherwise, you'd keep your mouths shut.
@TheologicalSong: You're joking, right? No one's poking around in any closets. He admitted he had unlawful sex with a minor. And the reason why people are still talking about it thirty years later is that he's been evading justice and the law for as long.
@Senator Sully: He has been on the lam for 30 years! You want to get up in arms? Consider his hubris and cowardliness in his attitude towards his crime. I sympathize with him for traumatic events that have occured in his past, but that doesn't excuse chicken-shit.
@TheologicalSong: Payback is a bitch. And who gives a fuck, a big fat fuck, what kind of hard life he had. He did the crime, yet never did the time. Until now.
@TheologicalSong: If your logic applied then all the Catholic priests and other pedophiles who are caught years later should also be let free.The analogy to Catholic priests who were found guilty years later when their victims were all adults is a good one.
The Holocaust defense is an insult to Holocaust survivors and their offspring including yours truly.
@TheologicalSong: First off- Polanski provoked the warrant for his arrest and extradition when he filed an appeal this summer stating that L.A. County district attorney's office had made no effort to arrest the fugitive filmmaker.
Secondly, I have skeletons in my closet...and there are certain 'celebrities' that hope they will always remain there. They touched a six year old where they should not have, and said six year old blacked it out long enough for them to remain immune to prosecution. I have no sympathy for a dirty old man facing the consequences of his actions 30 years later, when time is not on his side.
The fact that many others have escaped justice, does NOT allow for ALL to commit a perversion upon innocence.
@TheologicalSong: I'm sure you know that America's prisons are filled with people who were traumatized, especially in their youth. For example, most child molesters were molested children. Certainly the most enlightened response is compassion, but compassion doesn't extend to saying that these people were punished before they committed their crime and therefore should not be under the same laws or face the same consequences as the rest of the population.
If we say that Polanski's early traumas led him to commit this crime, then why will we make an exception in his case and not for less famous child rapists? We can't start grading traumas, ("my Holocaust is more damaging than your daily beatings at the hand of your father"), because people aren't stamped out on an assembly line and there are too many variables in individuals and their experiences to make such judgments.
Would Polanski have said, before this latest development started, that the people who killed his mother and his wife should be left to roam the earth and commit their crimes again, ruin still more lives?
As to your remark about the regrets and cringeworthy past actions of those who want to see Polanski serve his time, well, some of those people are or love victims of guys like him and they know something about trauma themselves. In any case, your remark is a cheap minimizing tactic. #romanpolanski
@TheologicalSong: You're so reasonable as to guarantee that everyone has an equally shameful skeleton in their closet. Assuming you not to be simply off your rocker, the inference is that you're judging others based on your own behavior; otherwise, you know, you're just talking out of your ass. #romanpolanski
@MissNormaDesmond: I didn't guarantee everyone's skeletons to be equal to Roman's (though I didn't realize we were quantifying here, which is its own can of worms), I just noted that we all have past actions we're ashamed of (and yes, I mean all, and if you insist otherwise, I'd have to say I find you rather deluded), and it's suppressed shame and guilt and anger at same that instigates the sickeningly endemic fingerpointing in our society. people should ostensibly judge less, and strive to treat others better, which requires a far deeper inner commitment, is my point. and if you think you're too good for that, then we not only have nothing to talk about, but you're an unprecedented human being. I am indeed judging others by my own behavior, MND, in that I have grown, through considerable effort and hardfought poise, to be proudly evenhanded and objective. that takes an inner refreshment and purity that seems to be rare. and requires awareness, and acceptance, of one's own foibles and limitations as a human being. #romanpolanski
@lil red: I'm sorry for whatever suffering you've endured. I've experienced my share, too. I've never excused the behavior. I'm simply skeptical of the purity behind a marauding witchhunt mentality. #romanpolanski
@crotchety: well, I'd counter that, because I think our justice system, and the philosophy, not to mention capitalist apparatus behind it, is deeply flawed and seriously pernicious, so I diverge from any consideration of it right off the bat. did it occur to you that maybe I know something about trauma myself? there's suffering in my personal and family history too, on a grand scale, with the Holocaust, and on a more immediate scale, in terms of abuse. but I come from a tradition of forgiveness, which I find far more healing than the cycle of punishment with its malicious Freudian underpinnings, which, as far as I'm concerned, does not heal or alleviate abuse and crime, but instead perpetuates a neverending cycle of vengeful behavior. surely there's a more enlightened way. perhaps it begins with leaving justice amongst the parties concerned, and keeping your nose in your own business. I'm quite certain we all have plenty of room for improvement, and instead of projecting our judgements on others, in some sort of purgative exercise, perhaps we might expend our energy in that direction, more rejuvenatorily. #romanpolanski
Untrue! He was set for sentencing when he flew the coop. I would say "convicted'' rapist, rather than "alleged.'' By definition, sex with a minor is rape since you can't have consensual sex with a 13-year-old.
@plasticene: No can use big words like "convicted" unless a judge or jury verdict is on record. In this case, it's not. Stop harping on Richard, y'all, he's worded this post correctly by journalism standards.
@snugbug:
And by "journalism" you mean something so wholly unedited that it makes absolutely no sense? Please read first paragraph and get back to us...
@BabyJewn: I agree that there are copy-editing snafus a-plenty in the post above, Baby J. But you know what? It's boring to read about it over and over again in the threads. Take it up with the editors/posters if you feel that strongly about it. Don't mean to be argumentative, just honest.
@snugbug: There is a verdict on record. I linked to it above. Why are you making these sweeping statements when you obviously don't really know that much about what's on the public record about this crime?
@AndPreciousLittleofThat: He was never declared guilty by either a judge or a jury. Attaching the "alleged" adjective is simply being a responsible journalist.
11/04/09
11/04/09
Meanwhile, Maine won't let gays get married, either. Maybe voters there should all resign. What a country! #racism
11/04/09
Not keeping the exact count of your black friends is just bad house keeping. #racism
11/04/09
It just needed to be repeated. #racism
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10/15/09
The Smoking Gun, motherfucker, do you speak it? Search on "Polanski", get a clue, and STFU.
10/15/09
Aha, third time's a charm.
By the way, this is a cumulative rant, rather than being solely provoked by any one person.
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Here's a picture of Pöschwies, where they might be holding him.
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Parquet floors! And neon lighting!
Doesn't that qualify as cruel and unusual punishment?!?
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Despite the serious allegations in this case, I think there is some sort of agenda in the US justice system about making examples public figures associated with rebellion. The entrapment of Tommy Chong and in court arguments to use his movies as a justification to come down hard on him was creepy and ridiculous. The extradition and imprisonment of Canadian pot advocate Marc Emory is a dumb effort too.
10/14/09
Polanski is an admitted pedophile/sexual offender, for which there WAS a victim and justifiable outrage. In this case, I for one am happy that an example is being made out of him, the same way they did with Phil Spector and Michael Vick.
10/14/09
Paired with the other cases it just seems to me that in recent times there is a vendetta against high profile counter culture types and a use of resources disproportionate the the threat they represent to the American public. It's not as though America doesn't have significant crime issues, is this the best resource allocation in terms of protecting society?
10/14/09
10/15/09
10/15/09
I have big doubts that broke ass California would be fighting for the extradition of a guy who fled the country 30 years ago after pleading guilty for a statutory rape charge if it was just a regular guy. A crime is a crime and Polanski plead guilty, but I really have to wonder about the amount of money and resources being put into these efforts to drag famous old guys out of other countries to jail them in the US. Was there a pressing need to make an example of him? It seems like most Americans had forgotten about the whole thing a long time ago.
10/15/09
Normally the public are pretty careful about not personally convicting an accused for things a court has not convicted them of, but somehow in this case that has been totally thrown out the window.
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Darling, your rant is precious and well honed, but he had sex with a kid, and ran away.
10/14/09
The Holocaust defense is an insult to Holocaust survivors and their offspring including yours truly.
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[www.latimes.com]
Secondly, I have skeletons in my closet...and there are certain 'celebrities' that hope they will always remain there. They touched a six year old where they should not have, and said six year old blacked it out long enough for them to remain immune to prosecution. I have no sympathy for a dirty old man facing the consequences of his actions 30 years later, when time is not on his side.
The fact that many others have escaped justice, does NOT allow for ALL to commit a perversion upon innocence.
10/15/09
If we say that Polanski's early traumas led him to commit this crime, then why will we make an exception in his case and not for less famous child rapists? We can't start grading traumas, ("my Holocaust is more damaging than your daily beatings at the hand of your father"), because people aren't stamped out on an assembly line and there are too many variables in individuals and their experiences to make such judgments.
Would Polanski have said, before this latest development started, that the people who killed his mother and his wife should be left to roam the earth and commit their crimes again, ruin still more lives?
As to your remark about the regrets and cringeworthy past actions of those who want to see Polanski serve his time, well, some of those people are or love victims of guys like him and they know something about trauma themselves. In any case, your remark is a cheap minimizing tactic. #romanpolanski
10/15/09
and in fact they are let free and ignored. constantly. #romanpolanski
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And by "journalism" you mean something so wholly unedited that it makes absolutely no sense? Please read first paragraph and get back to us...
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HE. ADMITTED. IT.
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"Responsible journalists" also take a cursory look at their work to make sure it actually makes sense.
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