@baconismyaesthetic: remember "directories" like excite? ugh. I remember searching for porn on webcrawler in ... '94. Deja is still around at groups.google.com. Downloading 50 usenet posts of binary and then converting to a file for one freakin' .gif scanned from playboy .. kids have it easy today.
If you call a fax machine and make crackling noises (like how people make fake crowd noise) what will come out the other side? This could be a whole new art form.
@bens09: Confession: I actually have some old floppies which I believe are filled with newsgroup pics, but I haven't had a 5 1/4" drive installed in years.
@baconismyaesthetic: 56k? Those were lightning fast compared to the 2400 and 9600, which were dominant before the start of the web.
It wasn't just "too-liberal" US Attorneys, it was any US Attorney, regardless of political stripe, who wouldn't bring corruption charges against the democratic elected officials and big campaign donors Rove wanted targeted. David Iglesias of New Mexico is no bleeding heart liberal.
Unfortunately, Pareene, I also think you should have your champagne now. That raving milquetoast Barack Obama will never spend an ounce of political capital having Rove or any other Bush administration criminals punished.
@lawyergay: Just as well, really. Such a move would send a good number of Freepers and Teabaggers running for their guns, looking to exact vengeance on the "New Hitler." As much as I'd love to see the little porker behind bars I don't need the additional aggravation.
Rove is a fat POS who should, but unfortunately won't, spend the rest of his life in prison (ideally joined by Bush, Cheney, Condi and the rest of the war criminals).
Judiciary officials report that the testimony was delayed several hours when Rove placed his hand on the bible to be sworn in, there was a loud hissing sound and smoke began to emanate from the book's cover. "It burns, it burns," Rove rasped painfully, before wrenching his hand free, reverting to the form of a bat, and flying for the open window while shrieking in pain.
You know I thought Bush was terrible. I voted for him, but we didn't know if there were suitcases w dirty bombs coming or what was coming down the road. It was a very scary time to awaken one morning and receive falling jets and crumbling skyscrapers. There was no Nazi plot to rule the world. We were flat out massacred on our own soil. If it took water-boarding to live and sleep easier at nite, so be it. But I still can't stand Dick C, Rove and their little monkey.
@BlackXacto: Sorry, but your sleeping easier wasn't worth compromising what our country stands for. When we decided to give up justice and morality for a little security, we lost our right to be shocked or even offended by such attacks in the future. Now, we're just another country that tortures. The list is long and full of scum.
@BlackXacto: Problem is, when America treats its detainees in such a truly appalling manner, it makes your enemies hate you even more (and for more concrete and personal reasons), which increases the risk of attacks.
Furthermore, by stating that these "enhanced interrogation techniques" are acceptable ways of treating detainees, the U.S. government has indicated, however unintentionally, that these techniques are acceptable for other, potentially hostile, countries to use on American detainees. (There are a couple of American journalists being held in North Korea, for example, that are in an extremely dicey situation because of this.) It's The Golden Rule in action.
I can't imagine anyone is sleeping easier because of this.
So Peggy's gripe is that a Great Nation shouldn't release its legalistic justifications for barbarity? Because I'd personally be much more inclined to say that a Great Nation shouldn't act barbarically.
A number of new books about the Holocaust have come out in the last two year. I've had the honor of editing one of them.
Hey, I'm going to sum these books up for you in a few lines: what was going on in the camps was known throughout German society. But: "we're fighting a war, it's not my business, we have to be tough, and...I don't want to get in trouble with the Gestapo."
Peggy Noonan and Karl Rove in their own ways show what evil is really like. Peggy Noonan is an illustration of deliberate ignorance. Rove -- a weak, pasty-face eunuch -- sees himself as a tough guy (as do Cheney and George W.)
Could the Holocaust happen again? To quote Sarah Palin: "you betcha!" And these are the smug bastards who would organize it and justify it, but never actually drop the gas or pull the trigger.
@smithhimself: Actually, the most difficult and important work is getting people to justify and excuse barbarism, especially in a society that considers itself moral. Parenting being what it is, you can always find sociopaths willing to do the wet work. Converting otherwise rational human beings into sadistic bystanders, on the other hand, takes a skilled propagandist...like Karl Rove and Peggy Noonan.
I don't want to restart the controversy on this thread but when I heard about walling, it made me think of the Gravitron that I used to ride at carnivals. Those were those spinning machines that would hold you against using centrifugal force. I did get sick once, so there you go.
@ChillbearLatrigue: AAah well that's a whole new dick strategy isn't it, Chillbear? "I don't want to restart this controversy in which I got the verbal shit kicked out of me, so I'm going to state my position and nobody else is allowed to rebut".
That's basically like someone saying "now, I don't want to offend you but you're ugly. NO OFFENCE. I'M NOT TRYING TO OFFEND. YOU CAN'T BE OFFENDED."
@Pope John Peeps II: Listen up, jumper. I was already debating the serious side of this on two different threads so I decided to write something short and sweet here. Got it? Since you are essentially going to stalk me to every battleground to rehash this, I will tell you what I've learned.
I was forming an uninformed opinion that water boarding, walling, etc. was not a form of torture. It would seem that at different times our government and other world organizations have considered it torture and it probably should be labeled as such. I also realize (and always have) that legal is not the same as right. Most of what the Nazi's did was legal by German law in that they had lawyers changing the laws to whatever was convenient.
Here's where I depart with what most of the people wrote to me. No one that comments on here knows what type of information was obtained from the enhanced interrogation. A lot of people think they know, but those documents are still classified. We may have been on a slippery slope, but we didn't slide down into villainy. At least not the people who were following the legalized guidelines. Abu Ghraib = Villains. Gitmo = non-Villains. The hyping of the enhanced interrogation techniques by NYT et al was sensationalistic and misleading. The constant use of the word "brutal" and convenient omission of adjectives like "flexible" (when referring to the walling patricians) were obvious attempts to stoke the outrage.
So, I agree on some points and not on others. To be honest, because I have reservations, I am just as glad now that we ended the program. However, that feeling might be changed if I find out that the interrogations saved even one innocent life.
Now, i will continue this debate on any of the other two threads that we have been battling on, but I am not posting anything else on this one. So either list some classic rock song that you would hear at a carnival or shut up, you pompous douche bag.
ACDC and Ozzy are still open. Feel free to use one of those. I won't tell anyone that I helped.
@ChillbearLatrigue: Read the Levin report that came out today (if you can get past the fact that Republican politicians have all been instructed to describe it as "partisan"). Anyway, as has already been demonstrated by a number of different sources, including Sy Hersch's excellent reporting in The New Yorker, the soldiers who were convicted at Abu Ghraib were instructed in their techniques by a team of independent contractors from -- tada! -- Gitmo. As Janice Karpinsky, the general in charge of Abu Ghraib, says (and she's correct): there is a direct line from the torture memos to what happened in that prison. And at all the grotesque gulags opened by this gang of villains.
08/17/09
Then Dogpile came along.
08/17/09
08/17/09
08/17/09
08/17/09
If you call a fax machine and make crackling noises (like how people make fake crowd noise) what will come out the other side? This could be a whole new art form.
08/17/09
08/18/09
@baconismyaesthetic: 56k? Those were lightning fast compared to the 2400 and 9600, which were dominant before the start of the web.
08/18/09
Can you imagine the smut that's still hanging around on old IBM punch cards?
08/18/09
07/08/09
07/08/09
07/08/09
07/08/09
Unfortunately, Pareene, I also think you should have your champagne now. That raving milquetoast Barack Obama will never spend an ounce of political capital having Rove or any other Bush administration criminals punished.
07/08/09
07/08/09
07/08/09
07/08/09
I think it would be better (though even more unlikely)if Bush, Cheney, Rove and Rumsfeld could be air-dropped into Al Queda territory.
07/08/09
07/08/09
07/08/09
07/08/09
07/08/09
07/08/09
04/21/09
04/21/09
04/22/09
Furthermore, by stating that these "enhanced interrogation techniques" are acceptable ways of treating detainees, the U.S. government has indicated, however unintentionally, that these techniques are acceptable for other, potentially hostile, countries to use on American detainees. (There are a couple of American journalists being held in North Korea, for example, that are in an extremely dicey situation because of this.) It's The Golden Rule in action.
I can't imagine anyone is sleeping easier because of this.
04/21/09
04/21/09
04/21/09
04/21/09
04/21/09
04/21/09
04/21/09
Hey, I'm going to sum these books up for you in a few lines: what was going on in the camps was known throughout German society. But: "we're fighting a war, it's not my business, we have to be tough, and...I don't want to get in trouble with the Gestapo."
Peggy Noonan and Karl Rove in their own ways show what evil is really like. Peggy Noonan is an illustration of deliberate ignorance. Rove -- a weak, pasty-face eunuch -- sees himself as a tough guy (as do Cheney and George W.)
Could the Holocaust happen again? To quote Sarah Palin: "you betcha!" And these are the smug bastards who would organize it and justify it, but never actually drop the gas or pull the trigger.
04/21/09
04/21/09
04/21/09
04/21/09
04/21/09
04/21/09
That's basically like someone saying "now, I don't want to offend you but you're ugly. NO OFFENCE. I'M NOT TRYING TO OFFEND. YOU CAN'T BE OFFENDED."
04/21/09
I was forming an uninformed opinion that water boarding, walling, etc. was not a form of torture. It would seem that at different times our government and other world organizations have considered it torture and it probably should be labeled as such. I also realize (and always have) that legal is not the same as right. Most of what the Nazi's did was legal by German law in that they had lawyers changing the laws to whatever was convenient.
Here's where I depart with what most of the people wrote to me. No one that comments on here knows what type of information was obtained from the enhanced interrogation. A lot of people think they know, but those documents are still classified. We may have been on a slippery slope, but we didn't slide down into villainy. At least not the people who were following the legalized guidelines. Abu Ghraib = Villains. Gitmo = non-Villains. The hyping of the enhanced interrogation techniques by NYT et al was sensationalistic and misleading. The constant use of the word "brutal" and convenient omission of adjectives like "flexible" (when referring to the walling patricians) were obvious attempts to stoke the outrage.
So, I agree on some points and not on others. To be honest, because I have reservations, I am just as glad now that we ended the program. However, that feeling might be changed if I find out that the interrogations saved even one innocent life.
Now, i will continue this debate on any of the other two threads that we have been battling on, but I am not posting anything else on this one. So either list some classic rock song that you would hear at a carnival or shut up, you pompous douche bag.
ACDC and Ozzy are still open. Feel free to use one of those. I won't tell anyone that I helped.
04/22/09