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New York, 10:47 AM
Wed Nov 25
49 posts in the last 24 hours

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    Dsmvwl  Admin  Promote to frontpage Approve user Ban user ×
    Image of TheSometimesWhy TheSometimesWhy
    02:13 AM

    In reply to How to Deal With Teens
    You know what slays me? How when people read about stories like this they immediately let loose with some riff on how "kids today are fucked and here's why..." I have some serious news for you: kids today are no different than from any age in which you or I come from. One of the reasons you're seeing a bumper crop of teenage witches, pre-adolescent bitches, and warlocks seemingly weened on the Grand Tit of Belligerence is because the art of parenting is dead and gone. They have joined the endangered species list. Why? Because they refuse to grow up themselves, to take the reins of parental authority they are duty-bound to grip but loath to accept because to do so ages them by implication. There is nothing "hot" about being an authority figure in their jaundiced eyes. So they try to be their kids' friends, and what you're seeing is the direct outgrowth of that approach. It is a recipe for disaster, tweaked to a T...

    Their only defense? The shit-farm we call a culture here in the United States. What are these kids nursed on when it comes to cultural values, so that no matter what good-faith effort a beleaguered parent makes, they are riding into a stiff headwind? Reality TV, Extreme Anything, and the blind hope that some day you may get to make a sex tape that is bought by TMZ. The American Dream has become a national nocturnal emission, replete with a cold and scuzzy residue that no amount of turning away will relieve.

    Or not.
     Reply
    TheSometimesWhy was starred TheSometimesWhy was unstarred
    Image of skahammer skahammer
    07:38 AM

    @TheSometimesWhy: OK, maybe I'm just dumb but I'll take your bait here: How do you know so much about parents' goals, and how often those goals include becoming their kids' "friends"?

    I would consider that statement extremely hard to substantiate -- what parent is going to admit to it? Thus you're left with what you've observed about parenting...95% of which takes place behind closed doors.

    So your statement probably has meaning only to the extent that you've shared living quarters with a large and representative sample of families. And if that's really what you're claiming you've done, then I'm quite interested to know more details.
     Reply
    skahammer was starred skahammer was unstarred
    Image of TheSometimesWhy TheSometimesWhy
    11/24/09

    In reply to How to Deal With Teens
    Gertrude Stein had it right--they're all a lost generation...
     Reply
    TheSometimesWhy was starred TheSometimesWhy was unstarred
    Image of Tremonius Tremonius
    11/24/09

    @TheSometimesWhy: Yeah, but she was meaning that mechanic's helper on the Isle de la Cite who wasn't there because of the war he'd just returned from, and that's why they're lost, according to the shop owner. They never were civilized. Civilization is a three-step process. Papa described it as Devout as choir boys, then Cynical as night club owners, then returning to Devout through Cynicism, like a loose canon. If you're in war, then you never ever doubt your early rejection of civilization. And you never see the sense of spending your day working on a strange lady's Ford.

    Everybody except Basket is over 13 in the works of Gertrude Stein.

    No, not a spelling error.
     Reply
    Tremonius was starred Tremonius was unstarred
    Image of TheSometimesWhy TheSometimesWhy
    11/24/09

    @Tremonius: I concur wholeheartedly, Tremmie, but for the fact that the Gertrude Stein I was referencing was a character in an episode of the old Gomer Pyle TV show. Gomer and his buddy were off on a three-day furlough when they tried to hitch a ride into town with the Sarge. Not surprisingly, hilarity and high jinks ensued. Gertie (as she was known in that episode) was a cabaret singer at the PX on base, doling out witticisms as potent as the hooch in her glass.

    But I digress...

    I do appreciate what has to be the most literate response to something I have ever said here at Gawker. Truth to tell, you have now shamed me into going back to get my PhD, which will no doubt enable me to comprehend the full scope of your insights.

    Gracie mille!

    #tips
     Reply
    TheSometimesWhy was starred TheSometimesWhy was unstarred
    Image of AngriestGeek AngriestGeek
    11/24/09

    In reply to How to Deal With Teens
    Aside from normal teenage crap, she's probably acting out anger over the divorce, but if he thinks she's a problem now, "giving up" and "leaving her alone" will only result in ten times the problem in the upcoming years---though it will get a lot of middle-aged men laid as she works out her issues through college and into her 20's.
     Reply
    AngriestGeek was starred AngriestGeek was unstarred
    Image of morninggloria morninggloria
    11/24/09

    In reply to How to Deal With Teens
    This girl sounds like she's got a really promising career as a cast member of Rock of Love or a high school English teacher who goes on to get caught fornicating with her students.
     Reply
    morninggloria was starred morninggloria was unstarred
    Image of skahammer skahammer
    07:42 AM

    @morninggloria: I see someone's been ruminating about the road not taken, lately.
     Reply
    skahammer was starred skahammer was unstarred
    Image of deepey deepey
    11/24/09

    In reply to How to Deal With Teens
    If you follow that link, all the responses say "Oh, she's just at that difficult age!" and "Teen girls are always like that!" and "She's not capable of communicating her feelings to you right now!"

    Sorry, but no. She's just a whiny, spoiled little bitch.

    Do you really think that 13 year old girls are incapable of showing respect to their parents or acting like decent human beings? I was never like this, nor were any of my close friends at that age, nor was my sister.

    I think the real problem here is that we, as a society, raise a bunch of pouty, self-indulgent little beasts and then give them a pass because "they're just kids."
     Reply
    Trulymadlyme promoted this comment deepey was starred deepey was unstarred
    Image of Trulymadlyme Trulymadlyme
    11/24/09

    @deepey: Uh, yes. She is being an asshole and truthfully hormones or not she needs to be called on her shit. If not for her own well-being, think of the poor roommates who will be forced to deal with her bullshit.
     Reply
    Trulymadlyme was starred Trulymadlyme was unstarred
    Image of AgadorSpartacus AgadorSpartacus
    11/24/09

    @Trulymadlyme: Her roommates will probably not hold back, so if she is still a twat at 18, she will be knocked down a peg or two by her peers. Unless they're twats too, which is highly possible.
     Reply
    Trulymadlyme promoted this comment AgadorSpartacus was starred AgadorSpartacus was unstarred
    Image of pleppy pleppy
    11/24/09

    @deepey: Oh, come on. Her choice of words sucks, but the girl is 13 and sees her dad a couple of times a year.
    It's really not uncommon for girls that age to reject dad's love and/or friendship, and I'd imagine it'd be particularly hard for the girl to care what he's saying when he's not around at all. I'm betting in her 13 year old, un-nuanced mind, she thinks "really? you want to pretend you care about me, but I only see you 4 times a year? Back off jerk."
     Reply
    Trulymadlyme promoted this comment pleppy was starred pleppy was unstarred
    Image of Trulymadlyme Trulymadlyme
    11/24/09

    @pleppy: He wrote that he regularly saw her. She's being an asshole and using hate language. That shit needs to be checked.
     Reply
    Trulymadlyme was starred Trulymadlyme was unstarred
    Image of TheMac TheMac
    11/24/09

    @pleppy: Gah. I totally get the fact that some teenagers rebel solely based on the fact that they're transitioning into adulthood while the entire foundation of their childhood (parental unit) is breaking apart. I've been wild-acting-out kid.

    But even as a 13YO, I understood that my parents were my parents, and they loved me, and that there were certain things that once said could not be unsaid. I don't have the healthiest relationship with my parents today, but I still understand those things which I feel like is the thing that keeps me able to look past their flaws.

    I mean, I'm so over some of the attitudes girls/women are told are okay to have towards men from such a young age. If it's not "my father was never a real father!" than it's "my father wanted me to be his little girl forever!" I know when you're a 13YO girl, men seem like another species who have languages and agendas and ways that are foreign...that's why it's important to try to build a relationship with the one man who doesn't have a fucking agenda. Where does she get off (in her little ignorant and immature way) questioning her father's masculinity? Cause that's what the "that's gay" stuff is about, right- "you're not a man!" Fuck that. Like she would know the first thing about losing your home and marriage and half your paycheck to people who may never love you ever again.

    I know some parents suck and I don't think people should just sweep that under the rug, but I feel like this whole teen-adult generation has this attitude like, it's parents jobs to ensure that they make their kids happy enough to not want to cut them off when they're 21. Like, almost every other person I know is estranged from one of their parents. And I wonder how these people would feel when they're 45 and parents themselves and want to connect their kids to grandma and grandpa, and Papa was like, "eh, no thanks..."
     Reply
    TheMac was starred TheMac was unstarred
    Image of deepey deepey
    11/24/09

    @pleppy: I would agree, except that it seems (from this letter at least) that he's not "pretending" to care - he seems genuinely hurt and unsure of how to proceed. Hence, her dismissive behavior makes her sound like a twat.

    That's not to say she'll never outgrow it, or that this particular case doesn't have some extenuating circumstances we don't know about...I just think that our society is generally to accepting of inconsiderate, disrespectful and selfish behavior from children (who then turn into inconsiderate, disrespectful and selfish adults - or at least, they often do).
     Reply
    Edited by deepey at 11/24/09 5:45 PM deepey was starred deepey was unstarred
    Image of thursdaynext27 thursdaynext27
    11/24/09

    @Trulymadlyme: The first sentence in the letter: "My children live several hours away. I drive to see them for a weekend in the spring, fall and winter, and in the summer, they visit me for two weeks."

    2 weeks + 3 weekends + living several hours away [not =] regularly seeing them. There are clearly some issues in this family we're not aware of and it's too easy to assume it's all her fault.

    Can he see them more often, thus reducing the need for this long distance relationship? Can the parents sit down with her together and talk this out--and listen to her? Bring in a neutral party like a family counselor? Does he understand that some teens do not appreciate parents showing up in their social/communication space, that they seem pathetic when they think they are hip?

    The fact is she's 13 and dealing with divorce. Why does the responsibility to being the adult fall to her?
     Reply
    thursdaynext27 was starred thursdaynext27 was unstarred
    Image of Better to Eat You With Better to Eat You With
    11/24/09

    @thursdaynext27: The "I drive to see them" smacks of a persecution complex, too. Why not just say that he sees them? Because he wants to be congratulated for the effort. He probably bitches/will bitch to all his friends and coworkers about how his ex and kids are bankrupting him via his child support obligations, too.
     Reply
    kappakappaspankme promoted this comment Better to Eat You With was starred Better to Eat You With was unstarred
    Image of kappakappaspankme kappakappaspankme
    12:16 AM

    @Better to Eat You With: FACT: That dreadful, beast of a daughter is far better off without a tosser of a father like this guy.

    He has to drive to see his damn kid. Boo hoo. And when she refuses to blow bubbles at him and allow him to treat her poorly, he takes to the internet to whine about it. Publicly.

    Stand up fellow the dad is, all right.

    Tween daughter should be tonguelashed for resorting to calling her father ghey because not only is it disgusting to use ghey as an epithet but it's mind-numbingly uncreative. Father needs to be slapped upside the head with a sock full of common sense and stop acting like the phucking child in that relationship.

    Damn - parenting isn't an easy job but people have a way of making it a lot harder than it has to be.

    /rant
     Reply
    kappakappaspankme was starred kappakappaspankme was unstarred
    Image of Wrapitup Wrapitup
    01:21 AM

    @kappakappaspankme: You said it.
     Reply
    Wrapitup was starred Wrapitup was unstarred
    Image of AzureTexan AzureTexan
    11/24/09

    In reply to How to Deal With Teens
    He could always sell her to the circus.

    (Don't laugh. Notwithstanding that little episode with Knute the Knife Thrower, the Bearded Lady and I have been very happy together.)
     Reply
    AzureTexan was starred AzureTexan was unstarred
    Image of Conchie Birdie Conchie Birdie
    11/24/09

    In reply to How to Deal With Teens
    Ask Alec Baldwin. - Wouldn't that be a great advice column? I know I'd read it.
     Reply
    Conchie Birdie was starred Conchie Birdie was unstarred
    Image of senatormayer senatormayer
    11/24/09

    @Conchie Birdie: I could only wish Alec Baldwin was my daddy......
     Reply
    senatormayer was starred senatormayer was unstarred
    Image of m4ximusprim3 m4ximusprim3
    11/24/09

    In reply to How to Deal With Teens
    Send her a care package with condoms and a Glock and call her in 5 years.

    If she answers, you've done a good job.
     Reply
    m4ximusprim3 was starred m4ximusprim3 was unstarred
    Image of manchops manchops
    11/24/09

    In reply to How to Deal With Teens
    I highly recommend this link on the onion, possibly one of the best things they did: "Group of popular girls reduce nation to tears!"

    [www.theonion.com]
     Reply
    manchops was starred manchops was unstarred
    Image of Trulymadlyme Trulymadlyme
    11/24/09

    In reply to How to Deal With Teens
    Man. Teenagers are such assholes sometimes.
     Reply
    Trulymadlyme was starred Trulymadlyme was unstarred
    Image of TabithaIapetus TabithaIapetus
    11/24/09

    @Trulymadlyme: Sometimes?!
     Reply
    Trulymadlyme promoted this comment TabithaIapetus was starred TabithaIapetus was unstarred
    Image of Richard Petty Bourgeoisie Richard Petty Bourgeoisie
    11/24/09

    In reply to How to Deal With Teens
    DO NOT call her a "pig" unless you're sure you're not being taped.
     Reply
    Richard Petty Bourgeoisie was starred Richard Petty Bourgeoisie was unstarred
    Image of Tremonius Tremonius
    11/24/09

    @Richard Petty Bourgeoisie: Right. And you should expect that, if you are at least normally alert, if you leave a message on an answering machine.
     Reply
    Tremonius was starred Tremonius was unstarred
    Image of Spirit Fingers Spirit Fingers
    11/24/09

    In reply to Tween Protests Anomie of Modern Urban Life
    This is unfortunate. And despite the knowledge and truth that most of us wouldn't necessarily see anything wrong with a lone 13 year old riding the subway...I wonder what's happened to us where we can see a child by themselves and overlook him.

    Like whenever we see obviously young children posturing by their lonesome, when they're selling candy ("I'm not selling candy for no basketball team."), dancing and doing tricks in dirty jeans and t-shirts, or riding in a group when it's clearly school hours. We usually just roll our eyes. Perhaps we shell out a dollar, but really we don't take into consideration that it isn't safe, that they are still babies, really, and that they should be protected, and not disregarded as the "culture" of subway travel.

    I know, we as adults should be asking questions of the kids, but that could be dangerous too. Perhaps ACS really needs to start working with transit, so that we stop looking at independent children as merely annoyances, entertainment, or "par for the course."
     Reply
    Spirit Fingers was starred Spirit Fingers was unstarred
    Image of sanyucat sanyucat
    11/24/09

    In reply to Tween Protests Anomie of Modern Urban Life
    The time or two I have attempted to provide assistance to children in NYC, I have been greeted by indifference at best. Including the time I saved a toddler from GALLOPING into traffic on Lexington while his parents were at least half a block behind us. So I typically just leave kids alone. Plus, I don't think most reasonable people would assume a 13-year-old looks too young to ride the subway by himself, except perhaps late at night.
     Reply
    sanyucat was starred sanyucat was unstarred
    Image of VoxPopuli VoxPopuli
    11/24/09

    In reply to Tween Protests Anomie of Modern Urban Life
    I'm about to hop on the train to go to work. Please, no one say hi to me. Strangers who talk to me on the train, other than to get directions, kind of weird me out.

    Like someone said further downthread - it probably didn't seem so unusual to the people who were on the train for 10 minutes. And I think most people spend their time on the train reading or zoning out.

    When you've got lots of people crammed in a small space, it's the only real alternative. I prefer when people ignore me on the train - it's an acknowledgment that we're involuntarily in each other's personal space and we're trying as much as possible not to intrude.

    If he was sitting up napping, with headphones on, he probably looked like every other teenager on the train.

    Yes, it's a very sad story and I do think the parents are having a hard time trying to figure out what to do. His mother says as much. He was diagnosed with Asperger's only a few years ago.

    Were the people on the train heartless? No, probably not. Clueless? Sure.
     Reply
    Edited by VoxPopuli at 11/24/09 12:05 PM VoxPopuli was starred VoxPopuli was unstarred
    Image of mladen mladen
    11/24/09

    In reply to Tween Protests Anomie of Modern Urban Life
    And did he ever return?
    No he never returned
    And his fate is still unlearned,
    He may ride forever
    'Neath the streets of....

    uh....

    oh....

    Fuck Boston.
     Reply
    mladen was starred mladen was unstarred
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