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New York, 8:52 AM
Mon Dec 7
15 posts in the last 24 hours

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    Image of ErasmusLucage ErasmusLucage
    07/21/09

    In reply to Was Blogging Just a Fad?
    Re: the whole exaggerated patricide thing, it's also worth noting how obviously parasitic a lot of new media still is. Like, the killer thing with Twitter is being able to discuss, in real-time, something that a large number of people are watching -- i.e. a big, centralized, media event (real, fictional, whatever), preferably on TV. And, moreover, non-TiVo'd, real-time TV that hasn't been Balkanized by satellite/cable.
     Reply
    Nick Denton promoted this comment ErasmusLucage was starred ErasmusLucage was unstarred
    Image of Edward Lionheart Edward Lionheart
    07/20/09

    In reply to Was Blogging Just a Fad?
    Does Mr. Rosenberg deal with the issue of people with really vulnerable egos who blog, especially when they blog for larger entities and have no control over commenters? I'm not thinking of any person in particular coughLeeSiegelcough but actually beyond the specific cases is there transformation of normal person into paranoid monster?
     Reply
    Edward Lionheart was starred Edward Lionheart was unstarred
    Image of scottros scottros
    07/20/09

    @Edward Lionheart: The case of Lee Siegel receives some attention in SAY EVERYTHING. I found his story remarkable -- not only for his original failure (sockpuppetry in comments) but for his choice, afterwards, to write an entire book attacking the Web for its failings while refusing to examine his own fall.

    As for those with vulnerable egos who blog for "larger entities" -- we're talking about a very small number of people here, yes? If one is lucky enough to have a job writing/blogging for a "large entity" I guess I'd say, one should be able to take the sniping of trolls and anonymous cowards. They're the people who have nothing better to do than waste time writing abusive comments, while the blogger is actually a writer with a paycheck. That should help soothe the ego. When I have been in that situation, for instance as a writer at Salon, I'd try to learn from the criticisms of substance and just ignore the idiots.

    Also, we do keep getting better at moderation and tools that make it easier. This conversation here would be very different without Gawker's new system, for instance...
     Reply
    scottros was starred scottros was unstarred
    Image of TroisFilles TroisFilles
    07/20/09

    In reply to Was Blogging Just a Fad?
    Blogging is to Facebook as Wives are to (insert answer here.)
     Reply
    Nick Denton promoted this comment TroisFilles was starred TroisFilles was unstarred
    Image of Aaron Altman Aaron Altman
    07/20/09

    In reply to Was Blogging Just a Fad?
    Scott - Your take, please, on Tumblr? I don't think - though I could be wrong - there's a more creative blogging platform out there: witness the recent book deals reported here at Gawker. It's easy to use, with the only shortcoming - that I can see - being that most of the people reading a Tumblr are probably doing it through the "Dashboard" feature, rather than going directly to a "Tumblelog." Thanks in advance.
     Reply
    Aaron Altman was starred Aaron Altman was unstarred
    Image of scottros scottros
    07/20/09

    @Aaron Altman: From what I've seen Tumblr is indeed a great (and evolving) halfway point between traditional blogging and Twitter-style "micro-blogs." I don't see a lot of links *into* Tumblelogs from the folks I pay attention to. Maybe my crowd isn't onto what's special about them. Or is there something about them that doesn't invite inbound links?
     Reply
    scottros was starred scottros was unstarred
    Image of Aaron Altman Aaron Altman
    07/20/09

    @scottros: No, one can link to Tumblr just as easily as any other blog. And there's a diverse crowd on there, from Gawkerers current and former (Pareene, Natasha VC and Maggie Shnayerson), to musicians and actors (Pete Yorn, Katy Perry, Justine Bateman et al) and dolts like me and others in the commenter milieu. And heaven knows, we link to plenty of stuff from outside Tumblr: perhaps it's just not as "go-to" yet as a resource as I think it will be soon.
     Reply
    Aaron Altman was starred Aaron Altman was unstarred
    Image of Nick Denton Nick Denton
    07/20/09

    @Aaron Altman: Tumblr definitely seems to have a niche -- but it seems much more prominent among East Coast creatives than among geeks on the West Coast. And it's lost a lot of buzz to Twitter -- even though Tumblr does different things and provides a much more seamless publishing service. Maybe we're seeing a balkanization of blog platforms -- with Tumblr retaining a position in New York in much the way that Friendster has held off Facebook in a few Southeast Asian countries.
     Reply
    Nick Denton was starred Nick Denton was unstarred
    Image of Aaron Altman Aaron Altman
    07/20/09

    @Nick Denton: Hmmm. Tumblr breaks down users by country: I'd be curious to know if Karp et al would share numbers to see how users break down nationwide. I gather that "Tumblarity" is one tool they're using to get their users to keep active - I wonder, too, if they would say. Still, smaller staff than Twitter, fewer (apparent) headaches - no Google docs stuff in the hands of TechCrunch, yet! - and they've raised capital, and no one is really bugging them about what their next steps are. I'd rather go the Tumblr route than the Twitter one - I get the feeling, perhaps a naive one, that Tumblr will do better than Twitter and its one-billion-user aspirations.
     Reply
    Aaron Altman was starred Aaron Altman was unstarred
    Image of scottros scottros
    07/20/09

    @Nick Denton: Interesting, didn't know that. The balkanization has been underway for a long time, I think. One of my arguments in SAY EVERYTHING is that all references to " *the* blogosphere" are suspect. Everyone thinks their own corner of the universe is *the* blogosphere, but the "sphere" is a lot bigger than any one person can really see.
     Reply
    scottros was starred scottros was unstarred
    Image of badasscat badasscat
    07/20/09

    In reply to Was Blogging Just a Fad?
    I agree with this post, however to me - as a blogger for the last 8 years - it all seems pretty obvious. Honestly, I think people set their sights alternately way too high or way too low for blogging as a "medium". Because first of all, it is not a medium. It is simply a platform. The medium is the writing, or the video, or whatever the content of the blog actually is. And the relevance of that depends on what's being said and who is saying it. And that's no different than anything else.

    I never used my blog to message things to my friends, and I never saw it as some revolutionary new form of media either. I use it now the same way as I always did - as a way to express myself, about various things, when I feel like it. I'm actually amazed when I check my stats and see that I have a few regular readers at this point, because my stuff is so random (but hopefully more in-depth than the "bad hair day today!" stuff that some people used to blog about but have now taken to twitter or facebook).

    I do use the social networking sites for BS stuff that I don't feel has any permanence. That's what they're good for. I don't feel like this is replacing blogs in any way, though. Blogs were never very good at that kind of thing, or at least I always considered it kind of a misuse of the platform to have all these permanent pages out there just talking a bunch of nonsense.
     Reply
    badasscat was starred badasscat was unstarred
    Image of scottros scottros
    07/20/09

    @badasscat: Precisely. We used email for *everything* back in the day because we could, but at some point it became less useful for most things. But now it has a specific place; we know what it's best for. Same with blogs.

    Your description -- "as a way to express myself about various things when I feel like it" -- is exactly what I wrote SAY EVERYTHING about. For so many of us it's just not about getting thousands of readers or pumping up revenue.
     Reply
    scottros was starred scottros was unstarred
    Image of ninety_nine ninety_nine
    07/20/09

    In reply to Was Blogging Just a Fad?
    All this 'blogging is dead' chest-beating strikes me as more of the petulance of people who were just as frustrated that, say, Beanie Babies eventually stopped being an effective pyramid scheme -- an argument more evidenced in the comments than your excerpt, which seems to have a more sober take on the matter.

    Doesn't anyone remember that MySpace was THE FUTURE OF THE INTERNET AND THE UNIVERSE just two (three?) years back? Content technologies mature and continue to serve audiences large and small. The race to Twitter has more to do with gold rush mentality. Many (most?) people who started a blog weren't worried about getting an invite to TED or founders equity.

    The fallacy of 'blogging' is that most people could write as well as professional journalists. Twitter has certainly solved that problem, but I'm not sure that's a problem I wanted solved. I like a higher barrier to entry. Minimizes chaff.

    Also: I like this feature.
     Reply
    ninety_nine was starred ninety_nine was unstarred
    Image of Jill7 Jill7
    07/20/09

    @ninety_nine:Are you telling me I won't be able to use my Beanie Babies to fund my retirement? What do expect me to use, a 401(K)?
     Reply
    Nick Denton promoted this comment Jill7 was starred Jill7 was unstarred
    Image of Ryan Tate Ryan Tate
    07/20/09

    In reply to Was Blogging Just a Fad?
    We're all nuts, bloggers. And the most successful seem to be the most obsessive and eccentric (see: Hilton, Perez; Finke, Nikki; Drudge, Matt; Winer, Dave; Arrington, Mike).

    Does blogging simply enable the obsessive personality to express itself, or does it actually help drive people mad?
     Reply
    Ryan Tate was starred Ryan Tate was unstarred
    Image of scottros scottros
    07/20/09

    @Ryan Tate: Probably both. I think some obsessives will find relief. Others will indeed go off the deep end. SAY EVERYTHING has examples, I think, of both.
     Reply
    scottros was starred scottros was unstarred
    Image of Cynical Media Bitch Cynical Media Bitch
    07/20/09

    @Ryan Tate: I've seen it do both in the same person, as it did with Steve Gillmor.

    If you're already on the edge, it could send you over. Fortunately for me, I'm one of those obsessives who picks battles instead of jumping into every little controversy.

    This is why my blog collects dust for weeks at a time; I would rather reach people as a commenter on a well-known blog than to post something brilliant where no one will read it.
     Reply
    Nick Denton promoted this comment Cynical Media Bitch was starred Cynical Media Bitch was unstarred
    Image of DahlELama DahlELama
    07/20/09

    @Cynical Media Bitch: Ditto. Not that I feel like I really reach people as a commenter--I mean, I'm nowhere near the highest class of commenter on this site, and even the best of the best don't exactly dispense words of wisdom that keep my mind churning deep into the wee hours of the night. (And honestly, if they do, they're probably writing them in lengthy comments which I don't bother to read, because honestly, commenting to me means that you should be getting your idea across in some sort of clever snippet as opposed to writing a mini-essay. Kind of like this one.)

    That said, I've definitely noticed that the more time I spend on Gawker and Wordsmoker, the less I spend on my own blog, and yes, it probably is because I enjoy the instant gratification of A) knowing my thoughts are actually being read and B) getting instant responses, rather than constantly looking at the lame "1 comment" on each of my personal blog posts. But getting to write about subjects you want to write about is a luxury of a poster, and not a commenter, and as I abandon being the former for the latter, I can't help but notice an increasing inclination to disregard subjects of personal interest.
     Reply
    Edited by DahlELama at 07/20/09 5:04 PM DahlELama was starred DahlELama was unstarred
    Image of Cynical Media Bitch Cynical Media Bitch
    07/20/09

    @DahlELama: Interesting response, because I see Twitter as the place to dispense clever snippets while blogs are a place for slightly more long-form thoughts. (I try to avoid the tl;dr trap, but sometimes I succumb to the temptation to craft a mini-essay, particularly when it can advance the discussion. Like now.)

    I disagree with you that choosing your subject is a luxury only posters have; as a commenter, I jump into 1 percent of the threads I look at. The ones I do join are almost always of some personal interest; otherwise, why would I have looked at the thread in the first place?
     Reply
    Cynical Media Bitch was starred Cynical Media Bitch was unstarred
    Image of DahlELama DahlELama
    07/20/09

    @Cynical Media Bitch: Perhaps because I don't use Twitter (though someone's on there with the name dahlelama), I don't think of it as having that purpose, possibly because I very seldom read a tweet that actually is clever or informative or in fact serves any purpose for which I look to Gawker's commentariat. I do retract my use of the word "snippets," since that does in fact denote more of a "tweet"-sized comment, but I'm still lacking a better word. Paragraphs? Statements? Anything shorter than a mini-essay?

    And yes, of course one's inclination is to only follow threads in which they have interest, but my point is, what about the things you'd like to discuss in a Gawker-esque forum which will never be discussed on this site? Yes, the 1% of threads is great for those interests of yours which it captures, but to be able to discuss anything you want and get the feedback and opinions of numerous strangers is only something you can do as a poster. Unfortunately, without the readership of a site like Gawker, your blog about your passion for knitting yarmulkes for kittens will only achieve the effect of a tree falling in the forest.
     Reply
    DahlELama was starred DahlELama was unstarred
    Image of Cynical Media Bitch Cynical Media Bitch
    07/20/09

    @DahlELama: Actually, IHeartJews.com would probably be a far better place than my blog to discuss that passion. That is, if I knitted.
     Reply
    Cynical Media Bitch was starred Cynical Media Bitch was unstarred
    Image of DahlELama DahlELama
    07/20/09

    @Cynical Media Bitch: Ha. Well really I was just selecting a topic that would only be covered by a personal blog, but feel free to replace that with any specific interest that you would not imagine to be covered on a mainstream blog/comment site.
     Reply
    DahlELama was starred DahlELama was unstarred
    Image of Cynical Media Bitch Cynical Media Bitch
    07/20/09

    In reply to Was Blogging Just a Fad?
    I've spent my entire career in print, the last dozen years in tech media, and although I'm still skeptical, I don't see blogging going away entirely. At least, not until the next big thing comes along.

    Twitter's capable of killing many blogs, but as noted elsewhere, some discussions just don't work at 140 characters. Come back in three years and we'll see what happened.

    The problem for me is that I've been through so many so-called "communication revolutions" that I've lost count. I look at IM and see CompuServe CB chat, at Facebook and see Yahoo! profiles, at Twitter and see IM, and so on. I'm beginning to think that amnesia might be an effective cure for skepticism.
     Reply
    Nick Denton promoted this comment Cynical Media Bitch was starred Cynical Media Bitch was unstarred
    Image of Nick Denton Nick Denton
    07/20/09

    In reply to Was Blogging Just a Fad?
    Let me preface by saying Say Everything is certainly the most definitive history of blogging. There are few gaps. You focus heavily on the early idealists like Justin Hall and the Boing Boing crew -- which is a good way into the story. But why so little about later bloggers like Perez Hilton who have so eclipsed the early San Francisco pioneers? Are you a bit ashamed of what blogging became?
     Reply
    Nick Denton was starred Nick Denton was unstarred
    Image of scottros scottros
    07/20/09

    I wouldn't say ashamed, no, because I don't see TMZ or Perez as "what blogging has become." Blogging has become a million things. TMZ etc. are more what happens when the form of blogging intersects with the long downhill run of celebrity journalism. You could say that the blogging format just gave that hill a much steeper and faster descent.

    I didn't write about the gossip blogs for two reasons: (1) philosophically, I wanted to focus on how blogs enable personal voices and bring new threads into the media environment, and the gossip blogs really don't fit either of those criteria. (2) Personally, I'm just not that interested in them, and the book, for better or worse, was shaped by my interests, along with my sense of what was significant.
     Reply
    scottros was starred scottros was unstarred
    Image of RonMwangaguhunga RonMwangaguhunga
    07/20/09

    In reply to Was Blogging Just a Fad?
    Just curious: Do you touch on blogs of people of color in the run-up to the 2008 election (for example the "Is Barack black enough" debate at the outset of the Dem primary)?
     Reply
    RonMwangaguhunga was starred RonMwangaguhunga was unstarred
    Image of scottros scottros
    07/20/09

    @RonMwangaguhunga: Sadly, no, though it's a fascinating topic. I didn't write much at all about the 2008 election -- having learned a lesson with my first book, Dreaming in Code, about the perils of writing a book about events that are unfolding as you write. (My deadline was Nov. 2008.)
     Reply
    scottros was starred scottros was unstarred
    Image of Nick Denton Nick Denton
    07/20/09

    In reply to Was Blogging Just a Fad?
    It's interesting that Evan Williams, founder of Twitter, also was the man behind Blogger, the first easy-to-use blogging platform. Blogger was swallowed up in the Google maw. With Twitter, still independent, Is Evan completing unfinished business?
     Reply
    Nick Denton was starred Nick Denton was unstarred
    Image of scottros scottros
    07/20/09

    @Nick Denton: I think there's no question that anyone who's followed Evan's career would see that. Of course now that Twitter has investors he doesn't call all the shots. But you can bet he wants to have the "build a big company" experience. He's in the rare position of having a second shot at doing that. I don't think Twitter is selling any time soon.
     Reply
    scottros was starred scottros was unstarred
    Image of FormerEnglishMajor FormerEnglishMajor
    07/20/09

    In reply to Was Blogging Just a Fad?
    While radio did not kill telegraph, and TV did not kill radio or newspaper, (and along those lines, wireless communication has not killed wireline) - hasn't the common thread been that new technologies eviscerate the profitability of the one before?

    It has distorted not only the slow decline of the earlier one, but it also distorts where money is spent, because in search of the "next big thing", VCs (and advertising) tends to get thrown too hard at the next "new thing".

    The old technologies actually threw off good money in their heydays. The new ones (pace Google and only very few others) do not - is there a reason why? Do you see that changing or is the Internet too competitive?
     Reply
    Edited by FormerEnglishMajor at 07/20/09 4:04 PM FormerEnglishMajor was starred FormerEnglishMajor was unstarred
    Image of scottros scottros
    07/20/09

    @FormerEnglishMajor: that's a great point. The Web had its share of cash too, of course; remember the late '90s? Or by "throw off good money" do you mean real, actual profits? The Net does seem to make those scarcer; it's so damn efficient. But the profits of the old industries, though diminished, are more predictable -- they come from known models. Which is why, for instance, even today, so many newspapers are still profitable. Just less profitable than they used to be. And their parent cos. often made stupid decisions (new buildings, lots of leveraged debt).
     Reply
    scottros was starred scottros was unstarred
    Image of FormerEnglishMajor FormerEnglishMajor
    07/20/09

    @scottros: Yes - real actual cash, or even just breakeven. Since no one "makes" money, it is hard to imagine what type of business model succeeds, since the only one we really have is a massive category-killer like Google. The rise and fall of businesses is happening at warp-speed now on the Internet, and you don't have decades of audience/readers/goodwill/etc. built up.
     Reply
    Edited by FormerEnglishMajor at 07/20/09 4:16 PM FormerEnglishMajor was starred FormerEnglishMajor was unstarred
    Image of scottros scottros
    07/20/09

    @FormerEnglishMajor: There is money being made by lots of small businesses, individuals, and even medium-sized companies. Just not really sexy stuff.
     Reply
    scottros was starred scottros was unstarred
    Image of FormerEnglishMajor FormerEnglishMajor
    07/20/09

    @scottros: Yes, that is what I fear for the whole shebang. While the older technologies had a big cushion, newer ones do not. Harder to build an empire or something longer-lasting. Thanks.
     Reply
    FormerEnglishMajor was starred FormerEnglishMajor was unstarred
    Image of Cheap Shot Cheap Shot
    07/20/09

    In reply to Was Blogging Just a Fad?
    Hi Scott,

    Is having a personal blog the equivalent of having an album that's made independently but ultimately goes nowhere without the proper distribution?

    Calling a blog "a little First Amendment machine," is brilliant.
     Reply
    Edited by Cheap Shot at 07/20/09 3:56 PM Cheap Shot was starred Cheap Shot was unstarred
    Image of scottros scottros
    07/20/09

    @Cheap Shot: Albums are more work than blogs. You can do a blog in bits and pieces. (That's how I used to do mine, between the real work I had to do as a Salon editor.) And if you mean a real CD, a physical album, then there's costs you want to recoup. But many bloggers are, I think, fine with just writing for a small crowd. With, always, the sliver of an opportunity that some unusual post might get linked to from some megasite and provide a 15-second flash of fame.

    "First amendment machine" line is Jay Rosen's, and it is indeed memorable.
     Reply
    scottros was starred scottros was unstarred
    Image of Nick Denton Nick Denton
    07/20/09

    In reply to Was Blogging Just a Fad?
    I'm a little surprised by the timing of the book. Doesn't it feel a bit weird to be writing about a phenomenon which is burning itself out? A lot of the cat bloggers -- those who posted every detail of their lives -- have moved on to Facebook and Twitter. Or they've lost interest. And the more enduring blogs look ever more like media properties.
     Reply
    Edited by Nick Denton at 07/20/09 3:43 PM Nick Denton was starred Nick Denton was unstarred
    Image of scottros scottros
    07/20/09

    @Nick Denton: I won't argue with those specifics-- but I don't think the combination of "cat bloggers" (and what they represent) on the one hand and the "I want my blog to be a media property" people on the other represents the whole spectrum.

    The rest of the spectrum is: people who are using blogs to tell stories that couldn't be told in public before; or to discover how writing in public helps them figure out what they think; or to leave some more substantial record of their lives in their own words in a form that FB/Twitter doesn't allow.
     Reply
    Nick Denton promoted this comment scottros was starred scottros was unstarred
    Image of scottros scottros
    07/20/09

    @Nick Denton: I won't argue with the specifics, but I think the spectrum of blogging is considerably wider than just the "cat bloggers" and what they represent on the one hand, and the wannabe media properties on the other.

    I'm thinking of the bloggers who never expect to make money or achieve fame but are motivated by one or more of: (1) test out their ideas in public; (2) learn what they actually think about stuff by writing about it; (3) leaving a record of their own stories more substantial than FB/Twitter allows.

    I do think these were common motivations in the early days of blogging, along with the (certainly also widespread) dreams of A-list fame etc.
     Reply
    narnio promoted this comment scottros was starred scottros was unstarred
    Image of Nick Denton Nick Denton
    07/20/09

    @Scott Rosenberg: Why wouldn't you want to adopt Facebook and Twitter as blogging mediums? I can see how they're different: more structured, more social. But people are clearly using them as blogging platforms. I can so rarely be bothered to update my personal blog -- and it's so easy to post up a photo on Facebook or a thought on Twitter. Why not -- at least for the purposes of marketing a book about a trend -- take them as merely the latest manifestations?
     Reply
    Nick Denton promoted this comment Nick Denton was starred Nick Denton was unstarred
    Image of scottros scottros
    07/20/09

    @Nick Denton: But you didn't blog that much even in the heyday (of yr own blog), right? If I remember correctly.

    FB/Twitter are great, but you don't have that chance for your own voice to predominate. Everything's embedded in the network. Also the postings are more ephemeral -- Twitter seems to have no past. Tweets have URLs but no way to find them once they're old.
     Reply
    Nick Denton promoted this comment Edited by scottros at 07/20/09 4:24 PM scottros was starred scottros was unstarred
    Image of Nick Denton Nick Denton
    07/20/09

    @scottros: Actually, I did blog quite a bit in 2001 and 2002. I was one of those warbloggers you write about. So I'm slightly relieved that the urls from that period were broken in some switch of publishing systems. (It's not just Twitter posts that get lost.) There are some embarrassingly belligerent pieces I wrote about the proposed invasion of Iraq -- though I think I also argued for partition rather than outright occupation of the whole country.
     Reply
    Nick Denton promoted this comment Nick Denton was starred Nick Denton was unstarred
    Image of Anthony De Rosa Anthony De Rosa
    07/20/09

    @Nick Denton:

    I think tumblr provides that blogging platform that fits exactly into what you're looking for. It's more viral than traditional blogging and allows you to be as pithy or expansive in how much you want to publish. It works really well for one off images, thoughts and ideas and provides instant feedback from the community.
     Reply
    Anthony De Rosa was starred Anthony De Rosa was unstarred
    Image of TRexstasy TRexstasy
    07/20/09

    In reply to Was Blogging Just a Fad?
    Hi, Scott, here's my question. Back around 2006, someone declared that the era of the individual's blog is dead. However, with so many of the big group blogs seeing traffic holding steady or dropping sharply, do you believe that the individual blogger can make a comeback or has the era of the Blog reached its apex and started to fall back?

    Thanks!
     Reply
    TRexstasy was starred TRexstasy was unstarred
    Image of scottros scottros
    07/20/09

    @TRexstasy: it depends what sort of era you want. It's still possible for new bloggers to Make a Splash -- look at what Nate Silver did last year. But the window for individual bloggers to sell out big is, pace Nikki Finke, probably nearly closed. My argument is that blogging started out as something apart from the hunt for cash and fame, and if it returns to that state, that might be a good thing.
     Reply
    scottros was starred scottros was unstarred
    Image of nirreskeya nirreskeya
    07/20/09

    @scottros: As is happening in the music industry.
     Reply
    nirreskeya was starred nirreskeya was unstarred
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