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New York, 1:08 PM
Tue Nov 10
55 posts in the last 24 hours
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08/13/09
From what I understand, "there's always one," so kudos to you on being the 2009-10 "Gawker mole," but really, it just seems kind of petty.
Didn't you stop to think that a "report" like this is just what the legions of cynical Gawker readers want? They eat this shit up-- all you've done is give them more fodder for ridicule; including quotes from Sreenivasan and Lemann about how now is a great time to be in school, etc. just provides them with reason to make fun of the institution to which you're about to devote a year of your life.
I guess the retort to my gripe would be for someone to remind me that with twitter, blogging, iphones, etc etc, nothing is ever "secret," and that probably no one at CU cares or is outraged by this (and I'm hardly outraged, just violently annoyed), but I have to believe that the admins at the J-school aren't thrilled to read this exposé. Don't you want to feel like at least something that's said in the walls of the J-building is between us (the students) and the CU faculty/staff? Will you also be sharing with Gawker all of the tips and lessons that you receive from your RW1 prof? After all, you're paying through the nose-- why take what they shared with us on day 1 and go right to a web site with it? The move seems catty to me, and also foolish.
I guess in the internet age, nothing is sacred. With so many different tools at our disposal, it should come as no shock to me that someone in orientation wanted so badly to get his name out there (even though Gawker is hardly a literary outlet from which you want to earn your calling card; try Slate next time) that he whipped out his camera phone, snapped a pic, and jotted down all the speeches, shipping them right off to a snide hipster-blog. At least your parents are proud of seeing your name in print, I imagine.
Of course, the point of journalism is to spread information and truth with the masses-- so in that sense, you've done no wrong-- but still, with writing like "...designed to help students prepare to be make news online," I think it's probably a good thing you're about to get a year of journalism education.
08/14/09
08/14/09
[deanstudents.blogsome.com]
It was hardly a secret. Dean Sreenivasan also posted links to the video on his Twitter. FYI, we're supposed to be keeping up with that Plan-it blog every day, you might want to get on that. Speaking of Dean Sreenivasan, I didn't quote him anywhere in this post as you claim I did.
I'm not doing this to, as you say, "get my name out there." As Foster pointed out earlier, I have already written for Gawker and a whole host of other blogs. I'm doing this because I think it's an important discussion to have. It seems to me like a lot of the criticism of j-school comes from people who have no idea what goes on during a journalism grad program.
I think it's funny that you're calling me a "mole" and "catty" when you're taking anonymous swipes online. I would never expect a fellow journalist to be "violently annoyed" at someone for expressing their honest opinion. That seems more in line with censorship and close-mindedness than a love of reporting. Either way, whether you want to express your anger at me in person or talk shop over a beer, you know how to find me if you ever decide to come out into the open.
08/13/09
I loved going to the Journalism School. Obviously, it's not vital to have to degree to be a journalist, my time there exposed me to various media and styles of journalism which I would never have considered before. Of course, I met contacts there and the degree is a plus on your resume. But what I most cherished about my time there was studying with very astute journalists who made me work very hard and who are total working professionals in the field. The degree and the education there is ESPECIALLY useful to those who are NOT already in the wealthy, private school, Ivy League educated who get internships at the New York Times and the New Yorker because of the connections of their parents. Incurring some debt to establish yourself as a professional is worth it. The job market may suck but in the field of journalism you must learn to think on your feet. Right now, things are in transition. I've opted for freelance work since even back in 2005, when the job market was better, as a mid-career graduate, I was unwilling to be a stringer at some newspaper in Timbuktoo for $30k.
The Columbia School of Journalism taught me reportage skills and inspired me to work harder. The term "you can sleep when your dead," the unofficial motto of the school, became my modus operandi and helped me publish freelance work immediately. It gave me confidence as well as the tools with which to forge a freelance career. The other advantage was the opportunity to learn other media, such as photojournalism and TV and radio broadcasting -- none of which I would have explored on my own. Thanks to one of the teachers there, I now publish photographs regularly and have been broadcasting on the radio.
As a journalist, you need to be an entrepreneur and figure out for yourself where you will place your energies and how you will do it.
What I didn't like at the Journalism School was the required so-called ethics class where an old guard media exec tried to drill into our heads that as journalists, we weren't supposed to espouse any political allegiances or have opinions -- the media is supposedly neutral. It really didn't surprise me when not long after I graduated, the traditional media outlets have begun to crumble.
That said, I highly recommend journalism school to anyone who wants to solidify their talents and explore new opportunities in the field. It's hard work but I loved every minute of it.
High quality journalistic writing CAN be learned. Some people learn it on-the-job but some of us may not HAVE the chance to work at an entry-level reporting job and a lot of reporters, if not most, could use improvement.
Naysayers out there: are you saying that the slovenly writing that many journalists publish wouldn't be improved by some rigorous training and tutelage? Due to pressures of deadlines and other restraints, many reporters cut corners and hand in stories that could be SO much better. So don't be so quick to applaud do-it-yourself blogging or mediocre reporting.
08/13/09
Did you miss the lecture on concision as a cardinal virtue of journalism?
[J/K]
08/13/09
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08/13/09
So yes, I'm glad to hear you're in J-School, Hunter, and that there are people who still value taking the time to train in the skills that are important in any form that journalism and media takes in the future. Non-journalists seem to take these skills forgranted, to think they just show up, or that if they're absent, they won't be missed. False on all accounts.
They are crucial skills, hard-won by both experience and training, and any democratic society depends upon them.
08/13/09
Journalism is moving online and, so far, people haven't really figured out how to monetize that. Audiences for news content are growing though and I think there is much more potential to monetize real journalism online. I think those who don't do original reporting are the ones who have questionable prospects.
08/13/09
This isn't like the old days of print; you have to understand the technical aspects of the medium you are writing for.
08/13/09
Columbia offers training in Flash, photojournalism, audio storytelling, and social media. I don't really get what they'd do in the social media course, but the others all seem like they could be useful.
08/12/09
08/13/09
I'm iving in an apartment with two other j-schoolers who both had been working outside of the US. One of them was a newspaper editor in Cairo and the other had job in Paris with a company that works with African media outlets. Many of the international students I've been meeting during orientation also left behind jobs in other countries to be here. All of these folks expect to be able to find new jobs after graduation.
I always hoped to be a foreign correspondent so I have no problem moving for work once I'm done here.
08/12/09
I can say without a doubt that all my J-school degree ever got me was internships. Seriously. Everything else you must do yourself. You must, must network, and be able to impress real live people, not in an email, or some other goofy electronic based communication (Twitter, Facebook, not ever.) You also must have decent published clips. I'm old-school so in my world that does not include having a blog about how much you love The Clash. Yes, you need to be able to not just have the degree, but have some means of proving to someone why they should pay to read what you have to say. Some swirly script on a piece of paper that says you've passed at least 40 credits and a strong desire to, "report the news" "affect people with my writing" or "tell the stories no one is talking about" will just not be enough. You need to make the connections, have the tangible talent, and back up everything on your resume and on that degree you spent 40K for, and much of that starts with working your ass off to be taken seriously and writing and selling your stuff from as early a point as you can muster. The degree should be the mac & cheese, the side dish, not the pork chop.
08/12/09
And she still can't find a job. Basically, she has LITERALLY one of the best J-school grad resumes in this region of the country. And the only thing offered to her is basically a 15K readership podunk-town once-a-week newspaper. Even the so-called "connections" made at J-school aren't worth shit.
Sorry Hunter. I hate to be real with you. But you're training to be a milkman right as the refrigerator is being invented. Tens of thousands of kids graduate J-school every year and there is no growth in the industry, nor will there be. Print media will be shrinking for the next decade at least, all the while legions of dumb kids crowd the classrooms, all bright and bushy-tailed, eager and earnest and profoundly ignorant.
Newswriting is simply not in demand anymore. We used to pay for newswriting, but now that we can get it for free 24/7 anywhere in the world, it's unlikely that we ever will again.
08/12/09
I'm certainly not arguing that j-school will guarantee you a job, but i do think it can get you marketable and useful skills beyond what you can just learn on a job.
And with that, I'm off for the night! just moved into a new apartment for this school thing and we don't have internet yet. I need to go home, but I'll check back in here tomorrow if this discussion is still going strong.
08/13/09
Hunter, I suppose I would ask a few questions. If all you want is a startup or work outside the media, why are you in J-school? It's expensive and wasteful. And you don't learn any real skills in J-school. Really, really, really, you don't. It's not like accounting or biology or even english or philosophy. There is fundamentally almost nothing to learn. Learn style. Learn ethics. Boom. That's a few style books and common sense, which are currently free at the public library. If you disagree, I'd love to hear what these skills are or what the knowledge is that you learn in J-school.
I hope I don't seem too hostile. I wish you success, but I simply sincerely doubt that this is the way you're going to find it.
08/13/09
Essentially, j-school creates a proxy for a year of hardcore writing and networking. You could argue that it's cheaper to just do it yourself, but I don't believe your wife would be in any better shape had she spent that year sending out pitches to trade mags. If you're going to school thinking you're going to learn to be a journalist, you've got it all wrong. You should be pitching every piece you write. The point is to go there and be a journalist. That's the value: for 40,000 dollars, you're buying a year of time to quick your cafe job and instead focus on freelancing and networking. And you get a fancy new diploma to boot.
08/13/09
08/13/09
Firstly, work outside the media is Plan B. My entrepreneurial ideas all require having serious research and writing skills. Obviously, there's a lot of people who think you don't learn that in j-school and/or that you can learn it while working. We'll see what happens! If I am disappointed by my experience here I certainly don't plan on being quiet about it.
08/12/09
"training in research, writing, and investigative skills"
Why not just work hard and practice these same skills?
08/12/09
08/12/09
Nevertheless, a thing or two to keep in mind:
1. The prospects of finding the journalism job you want when you graduate may be slim indeed these days, but even in the best of times they've never been great. If you were looking for a career where you'd be treated decently and paid what you're worth, you'd be at the B-school or the Law school.
2. You will meet people there, both classmates and guest speakers, who can be useful to you down the road, as long as you're basically competent and don't act like a dick.
3. Having that degree on your resume will make a difference, no matter what anybody tells you, and even if you end up in some completely different line of work.
4. You're there already and the money's gone, right? So just relax and enjoy it.
08/12/09
Sad to say (or maybe happy to say?!) no one gives a sh*t about your J-school credentials.
08/12/09
"If you were looking for a career where you'd be treated decently and paid what you're worth, you'd be at the B-school or the Law school."
I'm sure the 2,000 lawyers who were laid off in New York earlier this year would agree.
08/12/09
08/12/09
The Foreign Service.
I'm not sure what the procedure is to join the U.S. Diplomatic Corps, but in Mexico you take an exam and if you pass you are in. Every major consulate and embassy has a press office that operates like a mini-news station. You research local politics, write reports on developing stories, and you get to talk with lots of important public figures. Some places even have a radio station, so you'd get to work on that medium as well.
What's even better is that you'll meet lots of journalists and newspaper editors, so if you choose to transition into journalism it will be much easier to do so.
I should also mention that you get a diplomatic visa, don't pay ANY taxes (not even sales tax) and your government pays for rent and sometimes even your car.
I'll ask a friend what you need to do to join the U.S. Foreign Service and come back and post it here.
08/12/09
08/12/09
[careers.state.gov]
If I get any inside info worth sharing I'll post it here.
08/13/09
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08/12/09
Thank heaven for the loopback address and /etc/hosts !
08/12/09
08/12/09
The jobs are vanishing faster than people can graduate from school. We are in an industry that is plagued by oversupply, overproduction and underutilization. You are in the same position as my classmates who went to work on the line at GM in 1980-something, thinking they were set for life.
For God's sake, be honest with yourself now, because you can expect to be making just over minimum wage for the foreseeable future, and forget about benefits.
Freelancing means you spend more time pitching your story ideas than you do writing them, all the while praying the company doesn't go bankrupt before they get to cutting you a check.
If you want a living wage and health insurance, journalism is not for you; go into PR or marketing. This is no place for someone who lacks independent income or an adoring spouse with a fat bank account.
08/12/09
08/12/09
08/12/09
08/13/09
Actually, they spend quite a bit of time on that, + research techniques, ethics, etc.
Journalists should be trained, and you may not know what you're missing.
Of course, unfortunately, that doesn't mean that it's worth the money, in a cost-benefit world. If there are no jobs, there are no jobs.
08/13/09
I barely knew what blogs were four years ago. Ideally, I'd like to do war zone reporting or a crime beat. Getting to do different types of reporting is one of the reasons I'm excited about j-school.
08/13/09
I think I'm going to have a very worthwhile experience, but I won't no for sure until i do it. If the naysayers are right, it looks like I'll be screwing up in a spectacularly public fashion though. Awesome.
08/12/09
If I had simply called/emailed some of the top names in the field and asked them to lunch to glean some tricks and trades, I would have saved myself a lot of cash.
08/12/09
The question is whether a bunch of top names would have made time for you if you'd written them as a nobody without even a journalism degree to give you some credibility.
I'm not really disagreeing with you. This degree seems really expensive and I'm including the value of the elusive "connections."
But our man's made his choice.
08/12/09
Ms. O'Brien didn't offer advice such as:
1. Have highly educated and wealthy parents who sent ALL their kids to Harvard
2. Marry a rich investment banker
3. Be the perfect mix of cultures/looks in order to land a broadcasting gig on ABC as the woman-of-all-races that still just looks mostly white?
Hmmm....I love it when the wealthy tell students and others to live without debt when living without debt is not something so easily done. Shame that Columbia invited a tv newsface instead of a decent, actual journalist.
08/13/09
I think you got us confused with white folks.