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New York, 10:46 AM
Wed Nov 11
55 posts in the last 24 hours

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    Dsmvwl  Admin  Promote to frontpage Approve user Ban user ×
    Image of brennanmceachran brennanmceachran
    11/02/09

    In reply to The Great Newspaper Firewall Is Coming. And?
    It'd be nice to see a online news paper really shake things up and not run itself like every other news blog. I mean, the hard truth is that the news will be online for free... So if the big guys hide behind pay-walls a large majority of surfers will be thrown to different websites. New big guys will pop up and become huge, if they can find a way of making money with online news. Be warned, there will be news pirates, aswell...

    But I mean why does the NYT have to run like a standard site? Radically change it up, maybe more like fastflip, maybe not. But something unique, with extremely relevant ads. It could work
     Reply
    raincoaster promoted this comment brennanmceachran was starred brennanmceachran was unstarred
    Image of raincoaster raincoaster
    11/03/09

    @brennanmceachran: I know a fellow trying this at Vancouverite.com but of course like everyone else, he's struggling with the model. He's the best investigative reporter on the west coast, though, so he DOES have an advantage. #newspapers
     Reply
    raincoaster was starred raincoaster was unstarred
    Image of Tremonius Tremonius
    11/02/09

    In reply to The Great Newspaper Firewall Is Coming. And?
    It was Sulzberger, who may or may not be the heroic pilot who dumped into the Hudson, who nailed the dilemma square on. Only nobody caught it. He said the Titanic was not done in by icebergs, but rather by the Wright Brothers nine years before.

    He should know. He's the Captain Smith of this Titanic. #newspapers
     Reply
    Tremonius was starred Tremonius was unstarred
    Image of FormerEnglishMajor FormerEnglishMajor
    11/02/09

    In reply to The Great Newspaper Firewall Is Coming. And?
    I've felt queasy reading about all the Times layoffs because I've been completely guilty of reading everything, refused to pay for Times Select, then I get to see the fallout of reporter blood-letting practically in real-time.

    If "crafty people" get news for free, then you will eventually just get crappy news. There isn't quality "free" reporting like, say, Watergate or even the recent Times Magazine on the hospital triage during Katrina.

    My friends in magazine and newspapers have lost a LOT, and it is because I and so many others just want it free.

    It was a huge error in judgement for newspapers to value "eyeballs" over "payment". The online ad thing doesn't pay for a huge newsroom. They might as well try pay firewalls and screw the "get the eyeballs and the ads will come and pay for most everything" failed methodology.

    If you own a business, you'll take a paying, small audience over large group of freeloaders any day. #newspapers
     Reply
    Edited by FormerEnglishMajor at 11/02/09 11:35 AM FormerEnglishMajor was starred FormerEnglishMajor was unstarred
    Image of Tremonius Tremonius
    11/02/09

    @FormerEnglishMajor: Had a relevant discussion, which I remember because not many were. A certain author of best selling romance fiction said she had rather sell books than have them read. I asked, you have maybe thirty million books in print in several langauges; rather than six bux a throw, would you rather have thirty trillion readers for free?

    Her reply was quite clever, but you know writers.

    "No." #newspapers
     Reply
    Tremonius was starred Tremonius was unstarred
    Image of TheBusinessGuy TheBusinessGuy
    11/02/09

    @FormerEnglishMajor: Beautifully put. The trouble with newspapers--and with magazine companies like Conde--is that the old guard had blinders on and never understood how big the web would be, or that it would be a rival to print; rather, they saw it as a way to promote the print version, and the print version, in their belief, would be the version uber alles. It was short-sighted and foolish, but then that is the way of newspapers. Unfortunately, we need them, because as you, Former, and others have pointed out, bloggers are great but they don't have the resources to dig deep and investigate the big stories. That takes money.

    And now, because you and I and others have had a free ride, the old media doesn't have the money to do what needs to be done. Foreign bureaus are closing, local staffs are cut, and major cities are threatened with not having a newspaper at all, let alone more than one so there can be different voices. If there is a no money to do what needs to be done journalistically, and no experienced people left to do it, the bad guys win. And that means the rest of lose. #newspapers
     Reply
    TheBusinessGuy was starred TheBusinessGuy was unstarred
    Image of Kimrod Kimrod
    11/02/09

    In reply to The Great Newspaper Firewall Is Coming. And?
    Newspapers are banking their future on whether readers put a value on news accessibility.

    With the options available to news readers/viewers, I'd say, don't let the door smack you in the ass on your way out.

    It isn't important enough for me when I have a bazillion other outlets for news that doesn't cost me a dime.

    I suffer from news-overload most days, especially the day that damn ballon went aloft. #newspapers
     Reply
    Unsolicited Advice promoted this comment Kimrod was starred Kimrod was unstarred
    Image of Unsolicited Advice Unsolicited Advice
    11/02/09

    @Kimrod: Well, in fairness, when the question is "What if we're irrelevant in 5 years?" the answer is never "Fold up and go home." It's usually "Pay off lobbyists and dig in with the lawyers." That's why music still comes out on CD, the postal service doesn't fire anybody despite a 2.8 billion dollar hole, and Chrysler is still allowed to produce terrible automobiles. Can't wait for the blog link lawsuits that have been brewing for years! #toomanygoddamnpeopleonthisplaney...
     Reply
    Edited by Unsolicited Advice at 11/02/09 10:52 AM Unsolicited Advice was starred Unsolicited Advice was unstarred
    Image of Tremonius Tremonius
    11/02/09

    @Kimrod: The theory is, were it not for the Times, we would all think that balloon was still floating away ... #newspapers
     Reply
    Tremonius was starred Tremonius was unstarred
    Image of Kimrod Kimrod
    11/02/09

    @Tremonius: Precisely, with their center-of-the-universe attitude they may have been able in the past...to convince readers of that...but they are dying on the vine like used car salesman. I feel no loyalty to them.

    Newspapers have fought this for several decades, but have failed to invent an action plan to sustain survivability in a fast-changing, world. I guess you could throw magazines in there, too. Conde Nast, Forbes, etc., are puking all over themselves.

    As the taste for news diversified, so did people's tastes. NYT is stodgy; stuck in an old-money, old-tradition journalism mode, not at all hip to youngsters or young adults who are seeking new modes of communication like blogging, podcasts, texting, etc. (can't wait to see where it goes in 10-20 years or so).

    Or, they just tune out to every day affairs and quite frankly, don't care about any thing else. It stuns me how little they know of current affairs. #newspapers
     Reply
    Kimrod was starred Kimrod was unstarred
    Image of Tremonius Tremonius
    11/02/09

    @Kimrod: I kept wondering why it was the local newspaper in this area which voted for the withered old clone McGoo at the 19% rate had half of its op-ed pages filled with wingnuts and neocons. It occurred to me that, while the area is overwhelmingly progressive, the readership of newspapers is largely comprised of the one demographic in which McGoo did well: the olds. #newspapers
     Reply
    Tremonius was starred Tremonius was unstarred
    Image of triplethreat triplethreat
    11/02/09

    @Kimrod: I'm curious as to the source of the extra-special disdain for the publishing industry. Last time I checked, my friends who were getting by making music are all struggling now because of people wanting everything online and free (or they are forced to tour nonstop as that is their only source of revenue); my filmmaker friends are likewise having a tough time because of the digital/"we want free stuff" revolution.

    I get that Gawker is home of snark or whatever but seriously all the cheering around here every time a bunch of writers and editors get fired is fucking gross. I spent last year covering the election--now almost everyone I worked with is out of a job. A friend who is a war reporter hasn't been able to get anyone to send him on a story in six months. We aren't "puking all over ourselves." We're looking for work, as our our editors, some of whom (gasp) were decent people who worked for Conde Nast.

    Change is hard for any industry--in fact I'd be hard-pressed to think of any who handle it well. Certainly Detroit didn't deal with the rise of foreign production well. Television screwed itself with an over-reliance on reality programming.

    I'm sure that had one of these sage commenting analysts been involved, none of these meltdowns would have occurred. #newspapers
     Reply
    triplethreat was starred triplethreat was unstarred
    Image of Kimrod Kimrod
    11/02/09

    @triplethreat:

    "I get that Gawker is home of snark or whatever but seriously all the cheering around here every time a bunch of writers and editors get fired is fucking gross."

    -I agree. I don't wish for anyone to lose their job, never have. I am one of those surplused victims. I don't feel compelled to support the NYT just to keep the doors open. I love the paper, but don't live there and can't relate to a majority of the content.

    "We aren't "puking all over ourselves."

    -Referencing the cuts in staff across the board, not showing extra special disdain for publishing. It's sad, period. It's sick that it is happening, I never dreamed of this. You took my statement the wrong way.

    "I'm sure that had one of these sage commenting analysts been involved, none of these meltdowns would have occurred."

    -That's just a cheap shot at the posters and the open discussion. You know nothing about us anymore that we do about you. How do you know we aren't working behind the scenes to employ those affected?

    Extra-special disdain noted. #newspapers
     Reply
    Kimrod was starred Kimrod was unstarred
    Image of Unsolicited Advice Unsolicited Advice
    11/02/09

    In reply to The Great Newspaper Firewall Is Coming. And?
    I hope those guys run off and found their own little useless blogs - the death of the newspaper columnist is long-awaited in my camp. These guys are far more dependant on the brands of their papers than they ever realized, and seeing the looks on their faces and reading their public rants when they find out is going to be marvelous. And if Friedman's one of them? Why, that'll be just like sipping piping hot flat-Earth Sri Lankan tea in your slippers and robe while peering through the window fog at a wintry hellscape. #newspapers
     Reply
    Unsolicited Advice was starred Unsolicited Advice was unstarred
    Image of If_I_Had_a_Poodle If_I_Had_a_Poodle
    11/02/09

    @Unsolicited Advice: Amen. My taxicab driver totes agrees. #newspapers
     Reply
    If_I_Had_a_Poodle was starred If_I_Had_a_Poodle was unstarred
    Image of Tremonius Tremonius
    11/02/09

    @If_I_Had_a_Poodle: My aunt was widely traveled and sometimes with Arlene Francis's other cousin, and her news source was also cab drivers, who told her what she already knew, which is de rigeur in the south. It was the sixties, and DC, and the subject was war resistance, and the cabbie said, "Why should these bums work; Red China pays 'em fifty dollars a day to protest."

    He was working behind a firewall of twenty dollars from the airport to the hotel. #newspapers
     Reply
    Tremonius was starred Tremonius was unstarred
    Image of If_I_Had_a_Poodle If_I_Had_a_Poodle
    11/02/09

    @Tremonius: He was working behind a firewall of twenty dollars from the airport to the hotel.

    You know what would be awesome? Getting into a cab and seeing that The Moustache of Understanding was driving it. #newspapers
     Reply
    If_I_Had_a_Poodle was starred If_I_Had_a_Poodle was unstarred
    Image of Tremonius Tremonius
    11/02/09

    @If_I_Had_a_Poodle: It would be one dull and unrewarding ride, but it would be better than seeing that mug spread everywhere else. I'd rather find Ben Bailey as my cab driver, thanks. #newspapers
     Reply
    Tremonius was starred Tremonius was unstarred
    Image of If_I_Had_a_Poodle If_I_Had_a_Poodle
    11/02/09

    @Tremonius: Dude, it would be hilarious. #newspapers
     Reply
    If_I_Had_a_Poodle was starred If_I_Had_a_Poodle was unstarred
    Image of misslinda misslinda
    11/02/09

    In reply to The Great Newspaper Firewall Is Coming. And?
    How is a monthly membership fee an inelegant solution? If it's good enough for J-Date, it's good enough for the NYT. #newspapers
     Reply
    misslinda was starred misslinda was unstarred
    Image of Mo MoDo Mo MoDo
    11/02/09

    @misslinda: But J-Date can get you laid. No such evidence, anecdotal or otherwise, exists for the Times. #newspapers
     Reply
    Mo MoDo was starred Mo MoDo was unstarred
    Image of Tremonius Tremonius
    11/02/09

    @misslinda: Lisa Loveit-Loveit from QVC gives it to you in delectable bite-sized chunks - "... only pennies a day" - which is always true according to how many days you're figuring. #newspapers
     Reply
    Tremonius was starred Tremonius was unstarred
    Image of misslinda misslinda
    11/02/09

    @Mo MoDo: Good point. NYTimes, take note--you need to get your subscribers laid, so you're going to have to add an entire section for escort ads. You can call it The Times Titillates. #newspapers
     Reply
    misslinda was starred misslinda was unstarred
    Image of futuremrsrickankiel futuremrsrickankiel
    11/02/09

    In reply to The Great Newspaper Firewall Is Coming. And?
    The real question is whether they're going to limit the number of computers that can be used to access an account. My family's all been using the same account to download crosswords for going on a decade, and I don't effing have the money for my own account. Sanctuary!!!! #newspapers
     Reply
    futuremrsrickankiel was starred futuremrsrickankiel was unstarred
    Image of Pete Gaines Pete Gaines
    11/02/09

    @futuremrsrickankiel: Post-Dispatch crosswords aren't good enough for your East Coast elitist self? Pfft. #newspapers
     Reply
    Pete Gaines was starred Pete Gaines was unstarred
    Image of If_I_Had_a_Poodle If_I_Had_a_Poodle
    11/02/09

    In reply to The Great Newspaper Firewall Is Coming. And?
    I support anything that gets rid of The Moustache of Understanding and Maureen No. #newspapers
     Reply
    If_I_Had_a_Poodle was starred If_I_Had_a_Poodle was unstarred
    Image of ModestProposal ModestProposal
    10/30/09

    In reply to Naked Self Promotion: How Hilary Rowland Saves Africa
    huh? who? sometimes I don't know if I'm not paying enough attention to pop culture or if gawker is messing with me.
     Reply
    Edited by ModestProposal at 10/30/09 6:07 PM ModestProposal was starred ModestProposal was unstarred
    Image of RandomLunatic RandomLunatic
    10/30/09

    @ModestProposal: I occasionally think Gawker has been nothing but a vast prank pulled on the Internet going public, but then again, I sometimes think everything I do on the Internet myself is a perverse sort of performance art, so that shows what I know. Which isn't much. Except the meds have worn off. #hilaryrowland
     Reply
    RandomLunatic was starred RandomLunatic was unstarred
    Image of resipsaloquacious resipsaloquacious
    10/30/09

    In reply to Naked Self Promotion: How Hilary Rowland Saves Africa
    She has a very short torso. #hilaryrowland
     Reply
    BookishLookish promoted this comment resipsaloquacious was starred resipsaloquacious was unstarred
    Image of Smitros Smitros
    10/30/09

    In reply to Naked Self Promotion: How Hilary Rowland Saves Africa
    African like Gwyneth Patrow. #hilaryrowland
     Reply
    Smitros was starred Smitros was unstarred
    Image of BookishLookish BookishLookish
    10/30/09

    In reply to Naked Self Promotion: How Hilary Rowland Saves Africa
    I've been told my tits could bring Camden back. #hilaryrowland
     Reply
    BookishLookish was starred BookishLookish was unstarred
    Image of gtaylor001 gtaylor001
    10/26/09

    In reply to Huge PR Firm Has Bunch of Kids Digital PR Strategists
    Since when was Edelman based in Chicago? Aren't they still on Broadway overlooking Times Square? Maybe Richard Edelman commutes to Chi-Town from the Hamptons...
     Reply
    Cynical Media Bitch promoted this comment gtaylor001 was starred gtaylor001 was unstarred
    Image of Cynical Media Bitch Cynical Media Bitch
    10/26/09

    @gtaylor001: Edelman's Chicago office is a "co-headquarters". #publicrelations
     Reply
    Cynical Media Bitch was starred Cynical Media Bitch was unstarred
    Image of Uncle_Billy_Slumming Uncle_Billy_Slumming
    10/27/09

    @gtaylor001:

    Edelman's real HQ is located inside an innocuous-looking volcano. #publicrelations
     Reply
    Uncle_Billy_Slumming was starred Uncle_Billy_Slumming was unstarred
    Image of If_I_Had_a_Poodle If_I_Had_a_Poodle
    10/26/09

    In reply to Huge PR Firm Has Bunch of Kids Digital PR Strategists
    The saddest thing is that this manager who is 56 now could have gotten online as a working adult 15 years ago and had a decade and a half of web experience while todays 23 year olds were still learning fractions.

    The people who made the internet happen are old and very smart now, with a lot of experience, not doddering fools looking to new grads to turn on their printers for them. #publicrelations
     Reply
    If_I_Had_a_Poodle was starred If_I_Had_a_Poodle was unstarred
    Image of burbere001 burbere001
    10/26/09

    @If_I_Had_a_Poodle:

    The story is a plant. Edelman was/is a leader in online viral marketing. They just don't talk about that side of their business, unless they get busted as they did with Wal-Mart.
     Reply
    Cynical Media Bitch promoted this comment burbere001 was starred burbere001 was unstarred
    Image of Cynical Media Bitch Cynical Media Bitch
    10/26/09

    @burbere001: Yeah, I think you've hit the nail on the head.

    There's also a world of difference between the web of 15 years ago and what it's morphed into today. To a lot of olds, it's still e-mail and websites, social networking was something you did face-to-face, and to call someone a friend meant that you trusted them. Now I get "friend requests" from people I've never met, and I can't quite bring myself to stoop to that level of shallowness.

    That attitude has been haunting me over the last year, though. I've previously scorned Twitter and Facebook as vapid wastes of time, and I'm beginning to wonder if I should just let my Lifeclock turn black. #publicrelations
     Reply
    Cynical Media Bitch was starred Cynical Media Bitch was unstarred
    Image of burbere002 burbere002
    10/26/09

    @Cynical Media Bitch:
    Just re-define the word "friend" and problem solved. I'd advise a definition of friend as "someone with whom you've had contact" and not someone you actually trust, actually like or even know. This is not so far removed from most face-to-face friends these days.
     Reply
    Cynical Media Bitch promoted this comment burbere002 was starred burbere002 was unstarred
    Image of If_I_Had_a_Poodle If_I_Had_a_Poodle
    10/26/09

    @burbere001: If it's a plant, it was written exactly the opposite of anything that is going to enhance their rep #publicrelations
     Reply
    If_I_Had_a_Poodle was starred If_I_Had_a_Poodle was unstarred
    Image of Cynical Media Bitch Cynical Media Bitch
    10/26/09

    @burbere002: Then I guess I'm just not as loose with my friendship as I am with my kisses; the word "acquaintance" is overdue for a revival.

    When you call someone you don't trust, don't like, or (God forbid) don't even know your "friend," then the concept becomes meaningless.

    (Sisters, this is how you end up in the hospital at 5am after allegedly being roofied, with no one there to listen to you explain that you only drank five mojitos, and of course you didn't have anything to eat, because you didn't want anyone judging you.)
     Reply
    Edited by Cynical Media Bitch at 10/26/09 8:09 PM Cynical Media Bitch was starred Cynical Media Bitch was unstarred
    Image of burbere002 burbere002
    10/26/09

    @Cynical Media Bitch: Burbere's tech rule #1: All technology alters every environment it enters. Yes, even interpersonal relationships.
     Reply
    Cynical Media Bitch promoted this comment burbere002 was starred burbere002 was unstarred
    Image of Cynical Media Bitch Cynical Media Bitch
    10/26/09

    @burbere002: Are you Professor Gradwell from McGill? He said something like that about a decade ago. While I agree that today friendship can be extended from real-life interactions to online ones, I call bullshit on referring to people as friends when I know nothing about them at all.

    For example, I have a small group of Gawker friends, and as far as I know, I know none of them from meatspace. These are people who have impressed me on these threads with their reasoning, their perspective and their ability to convince me, although I don't always agree with what they say. (I would hope that those in my small band of followers are similarly discerning, but there's no accounting for taste, or the limits of Gawker's relationship model.) #publicrelations
     Reply
    Cynical Media Bitch was starred Cynical Media Bitch was unstarred
    Image of burbere002 burbere002
    10/26/09

    @Cynical Media Bitch: No, not a prof. I'm just another smartass on the internet.

    The whole redefinition of friendship thing is not difficult. It's already happened to a large percentage of the population. They have more or less limited or removed elements of empathy and loyalty from the equation while instituting flexible time horizons/expiration dates.

    Stated another way, most post-modern folks would go Sopranos on their friends, making them part of a N.J. landfill for an extra Tommy Hilfiger gift bag during fashion week.
     Reply
    Cynical Media Bitch promoted this comment burbere002 was starred burbere002 was unstarred
    Image of Cynical Media Bitch Cynical Media Bitch
    10/26/09

    @burbere002: This is yet another reason why I am praying for an early death. #publicrelations
     Reply
    Cynical Media Bitch was starred Cynical Media Bitch was unstarred
    Image of narnio narnio
    10/26/09

    In reply to Huge PR Firm Has Bunch of Kids Digital PR Strategists
    That photo credit is gold. #publicrelations
     Reply
    narnio was starred narnio was unstarred
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