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Knock-Knock, It's Your Friendly Neighborhood Nazi

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mackensie
07/19/09

In reply to Knock-Knock, It's Your Friendly Neighborhood Nazi
Geez, you know, if it wasn't for the nazis in the US, we never would have landed on the moon forty years ago.

Just sayin'
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Pinekatz
07/19/09

@mackensie: Explain, please. I'm curious how German war criminals advanced the American Space Program. I am a student of life. Teach.
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ChillbearLatrigue
07/19/09

@mackensie: Those people were academics that were Nazis in the sense that the government for which they worked was a Nazi government. In any event, I would hope that no one is suggesting that we breed Nazis in the hope that we get a few scientists out of it.
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mackensie
07/19/09

@Pinekatz:
Wikipedia is your friend:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Werner_Von_Braun

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Paperclip
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ChillbearLatrigue
07/19/09

@mackensie: I don't consider Von Braun a Nazi: "When asked if von Braun could have protested against the brutal treatment of the slave laborers, von Braun team member Konrad Dannenberg told The Huntsville Times, "If he had done it, in my opinion, he would have been shot on the spot."" Considering the Nazi track record, I am inclined to agree.
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Edited by ChillbearLatrigue at 07/19/09 5:58 PM ChillbearLatrigue was starred

i'm a bottle
07/19/09

@ChillbearLatrigue: Maybe he wasn't a model Nazi like Himmler, Goebbels or Hitler but he collaborated at the very least. No one forced him to join the Waffen-SS either. He did it of his own free will, and early on, in 1933. Ask yourself whether you would have developed deadly and frightening new weapons for an evil regime using slave labor? Do you really think that, "I was really, really obsessed with rockets" would be an acceptable justification for your actions?
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Edited by i'm a bottle at 07/19/09 6:45 PM i'm a bottle was starred i'm a bottle was unstarred

ChillbearLatrigue
07/19/09

@i'm a bottle: I really find all things Nazi distasteful as I am sure everyone else here does, but a lot of the Germans of that era claim that they were forced to join various factions of the Nazi Party to avoid persecution. However, you're right. In the end, the only morally correct thing to do would be to refuse service even if it meant joining the unfortunate masses in the concentration camps, but not everyone has the courage or commitment to do that. So, let me concede this: You and mackensie are correct that Von Braun was a Nazi.

Rockets are too phallic for me. I hope that answers your question.
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Pinekatz
07/19/09

@mackensie: "We knew that we had created a new means of warfare, and the question as to what nation, to what victorious nation we were willing to entrust this brainchild of ours was a moral decision more than anything else. We wanted to see the world spared another conflict such as Germany had just been through, and we felt that only by surrendering such a weapon to people who are guided by the Bible could such an assurance to the world be best secured."

Thanks for the link. I appreciate it. WWII brought brilliance to the United States, a refuge. I guess when I think of a war criminal, I think of someone who worked at a camp or loaded a train or was first-person involved in some way.

The article seems to imply that he came here and became a loyal tool.

My governor's father was a Nazi.

You're right. Its all very complicated, isn't it?
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i'm a bottle
07/19/09

@ChillbearLatrigue, Pinekatz, mackensie: A man who sells his soul to the devil in exchange for knowledge, comes to regret it, but finds redemption because his quest to bring humanity further is inherently good. Hmmm, sounds familiar.
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Pinekatz
07/19/09

@i'm a bottle: I know. I wish it was simple. I agree completely, entirely.

Life seems to be such a bloody filthy mess, one generation after the next. No one learns. A 33-y/o American with every opportunity to succeed becomes a KKK member. 60 years ago, a scientist weighs his options and jumps teams.

I wish I had good answers. I don't.

Good Luck to Us.
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Edited by Pinekatz at 07/19/09 9:12 PM Pinekatz was starred Pinekatz was unstarred

mladen
07/19/09

In reply to Knock-Knock, It's Your Friendly Neighborhood Nazi
Naw, that's not Danny. If it were, he'd be wearing a standard T instead of a Rheabeater with "World's Cutest Nazi" on it in bright, happy '80s-sitcom-logo letters.

Mayer needed to look at Wikipedia before he helped maked a li'l Jewish baby. It's Brazil where you don't get extradited if you knock up one of their citizens (under what Brits still call the Ronnie Biggs law).

On the bright side, if his kid grows up, goes to the States and gets mixed up in neo-Nazi stuff - and quite a few of those types have proven to be half-Jewish over the years - he or she could always go back to Israel and avoid extradition under the Law of Return.

"The law is an ass" - Dickens
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ZanAutolycus
07/19/09

In reply to Knock-Knock, It's Your Friendly Neighborhood Nazi
The latest on Mayon: he was indeed shipped back to the US today, accompanied by marshalls, but vowing to return. He denies membership in the KKK or being a Nazi, says he does not hate Jews or blacks and that he "loves this country and wants to return". Meanwhile his distraught friends are trying to come to terms with his true identity. The girlfriend told local media that she "loves him" and wants to stay in touch. Another friend said he believes Mayon "has changed" and is no longer racist.

Mayon hid in south Tel Aviv, in an area populated with many migrant workers and asylum seekers, from Darfur to China, Romania to the Phillippines.
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Aaron Coleman
07/19/09

@ZanAutolycus: Thanks for the update! Interesting. They always deny it.
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BowlingForDollars
07/19/09

In reply to Knock-Knock, It's Your Friendly Neighborhood Nazi
I'd say they are only scratching the surface and that the Neo-Nazi/White Supremacist problem is far larger than we care to think about.

As far as the armed forces, remember when we only had to worry about the gays in the military? Good times.
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Swifter
07/19/09

@BowlingForDollars: If you want people in the military to be more like you, then go down and sign up.
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ChillbearLatrigue
07/19/09

@BowlingForDollars: I have to disagree. I think the problem of racism is still a huge problem. I would say that the number of Neo-Nazi/White Supremacists is relatively small and the groups disorganized. It's one thing to be a bigot, but it's another to join an organization that promotes racial hatred and violence. Both the set and the subset are malignant jackoffs, but I think that the latter is a small minority. Then again, we are just two people giving non-specific terms like "larger" and "small." I guess we would both probably agree that any number of these people is too many.
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Pinekatz
07/19/09

@Swifter: Hah! Have you ever seen Bowling? She could be a secret weapon. Put her on point, then when everyone is staring and disoriented (she's very purdy), mow them down or approach and ask if they would like hospitals, schools and infrastructure. Yes?, okay, here's how we'll do it...
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BookishLatkeish
07/19/09

They are disorganized until they get their shit together, and then they kill people. And they do, rather frequently, although, of course, even one time is way too many. Chillbear, I am PMing you. @ChillbearLatrigue:
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ChillbearLatrigue
07/19/09

@BookishLookish: Yeah, I somehow wound up on a side of this debate that I really don't want to argue. It happens to me about one out of every ten topics. I think just about everyone who countered me in this thread had pretty good observations and yes, BL, we never want to underestimate the threat.
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