By the way, I just read the article and it is incredibly stupid. Violence evidently equals creative and edgy to this silly middle-class bitch. And her points are the same ones that have been made over the last 15 fucking years without me noticing any slowing down in cultural development per se.
You left out their crap museum culture, their incestuous gallery world and their complete lack of civic philanthropy, to say nothing of vulgar motorcycle-stunt modern architecture and suburbs that combine the sprawl of LA with the dreariness of Kansas City.
That said, London seems a city more supportive of the private moment than New York. What is good about New York is evident to everybody: what is good about London you have to discover for yourself.
I feel it would be an excellent place to live while writing, because it's a city that, for all its size, doesn't pose immediate distractions.
@RollsRoyceRevenge: I agree with you about their incestuous art scene--does one newspaper have to profile Tracey Emin every other Sunday? But that civic philanthropy is filled in large part by the government or council giving London free museum entrances and many other initiatives and programs the public enjoy. Whereas in New York, the private sector has to step up for a lot of that kind of thing.
@elinorwhyme: I ask this question: when was the last time the Metropolitan Museum issued an announcement that a major work of art in its collection was about to be sold unless a collection could be raised to keep it? Philanthropy is an important part of all museums everywhere and about 30% of private support to the major British museums comes from Americans. A British curator I work with has described the situation as being dire in part because Lord and Lady Shitforbrains already have a country place full of Rembrandts and don't care to save the one at the National for the proles. Granted he did not use those words.
Oh Foster, come on now. I know this is all slightly tongue-in-cheek, but it feels like you are cranking up the isolationist factor in hopes it will get picked up by the Sunday Times: " New York Blogger Attacks."
Yes, London has crap service and none of the convenience New York has, however it really is a more global city and has some gentle civilities that are usually lost on residents. Forgive me, but the difference between my minicab driver's courtesy on the way to Heathrow yesterday and the asshole cabbie who picked me up at JFK and then yelled at me for giving him a non-cash tip has left me feeling fragile.
Whatevsies, Foster, the people have a right to know that last time you came back from London you were all best weekend of my liiiife and I'm in lurv with a girrrrll and ooh I recorded a Vimeo of me singing and strolling down the riverrrr and also you went to some market with fruits and veggies that you were all into but I'm more hazy on those specifics.
But don't deny your true feelings. All the Jay Z YouTubes in the world can't change the forces of nature.
@Phyllis Nefler: Of course! I had a great time in London. I had this incredible mushroom pate at Borough Market, made a bunch of rap videos, and pissed on everything in sight. I even went to The Ivy and had Eggs Benedict for dinner. And I bought a poster from the Tate Modern, which is the best museum evar. I could give a shit. Are you watching how crazy people are getting about this? It's hysterical. Please note the
#iactuallyquiteenjoyedboroughma...
tag. I forgot to put the #desperateforalastpost tag and the #thingsicouldgiveashitabout tag. I was sad that St. Johns was closed when I went though. Oh well. New York sucks, London sucks, the only nice place left in the universe is Asheville, North Carolina and The Maldives, which I recently learned I've been pronouncing wrong for the last four years. Whoops.
Everything is higgly-piggly or whatever dumb word you have for it. We live on a grid. A grid.
Yeah -- every fucking corner in NY looks like every other fucking corner. I can ID my location in London within two seconds, but New York remains a mess of 90 degree angles to me.
Not a WEEK, not a fricking WEEK passes without some by-numbers article in the NYT or elsewhere stating that Berlin is hip. These articles are usually written by people who don't even speak German and wouldn't know what the actually scene here is like if it bit them on the arsch. Often the jist of these articles is: "Berlin! It's just like New York with cheap rents! There are artists here! And internet startups!" as though that weren't the case in every bloody major city in the Western world.
I love this city, but it's ludicrous to say it's outstripping New York.
Londoners are some of the fakest people in the world. They look down their noses at anything American, especially the people but secretly they're jealous of it and us and try to imitate it in any way they can. It's so sad and pathetic when they try so hard to be cool only to come off so obviously contrived and pretentious, which is why their music, fashion, food, culture and, especially, their attitudes are ugly. The only Londoners I've ever met that were worth knowing love NYC and either already live there or visit frequently.
I mean, what was her point? That NYC has lost its edge b/c things actually work here? B/c natives and tourists can both get the most out of the city without being rude to each other? B/c as much as you try to pretend that it's expensive you can still enjoy a very full life without having to spend an arm and leg every night like you would in London? B/c if you were to wake up at 3 am there would always be something you could do and someplace you could go b/c it's literally the CITY THAT NEVER SLEEPS?! B/c our basic amenities are virtually unheard of in your most expensive new construction? Or is it b/c New Yorkers don't even have to try and they'll still always be cooler than you and that's what really pisses you off?
I know to each his own but, seriously, it's really hard to bitch about NYC when it has so much to offer to anyone and everyone. It seems that the edge that she's missing from NY is when you were risking your life each time you stepped outside your door. Who knew there were people out there that actually missed the crime. Sorry that NYC is still the coolest place to live and also the best vacation city in the world. London will never catch up so just get over it.
@hotpinklovesofa: I've lived in both London and New York. I don't agree with the author's opinions about New York losing its edge (whatever the hell that means) but I'd also move back to London in a heartbeat.
The idea that Londoners are in any way jealous of New Yorkers is just stupid. They don't fucking care about New York unless they're coming here for the killer exchange rate before Christmas. London will never "catch up"? London was there before New York, and will be there after New York. (Probably quite literally, what with global warming.)
In conclusion: London's awesome, as are Londoners.
@hotpinklovesofa: Yes, all 8 million of us are just sitting at home rubbing our hands together (while drinking warm beer and eating gruel, with our DISGUSTING TEETH), wondering how we can be as cool as you.
Calm down. Both cities are pretty amazing and actually very similar. But to tar 8 million people with the same brush is a bit fucking stupid.
@Lulu82: That's great so when are Brits going to stop being so astonished whenever they encounter an American in London that isn't obese, uneducated, rude, crude, unsophisticated, uncultured, and completely oblivious to current events? It's just as stupid to color all Americans stupid fat rednecks, treat them as such and then act surprised when you get a cold shoulder in return. We're all left with the impressions we are given by the majority of people we encounter on our travels. I don't actually mind the city itself, and I certainly wasn't referring to all 8 million of you but there's a level of phoniness and condesenscion there that is getting a little tiring.
@limber: I like London but I'm lukewarm on most Londoners. Get rid of the attitude and we'll talk. I love me some Scotland, just as old but with friendlier people. Some think they're abrasive but I enjoy their directness over the phoniness of London. Again, subjective and based on my personal experiences but after 10 years of traveling back and forth, the condescending attitude is getting beyond old. If you're so secure why do you always try to put others down? Perhaps it's an industry thing but it happens pretty randomly too. Sometimes it's rooted solely in politics but I have just as much power over my govt as you do over yours so don't act like I can change everything but I'm just too dumb and lazy to do anything about it. Anyway, New Yorkers love their town but they don't try to make feel visitors like shit just cause they're not New Yorkers and/or Americans.
@hotpinklovesofa: I can't speak for the rest of my city, but I certainly don't think all Americans are stupid and obese. You must have met some nasty people. They exist everywhere.
As an immigrant, though (I moved to London as a child) I must disagree about Londoners making visitors feel like shit just because they're not from London/UK. London is the most cosmopolitan, welcoming place I've been to in my life. I'm sorry you've had a bad experience, but most of the Londoners I know are cool, intelligent, friendly, creative, worldly and diverse.
But what would I know. I've only lived here for 23 years.
@Lulu82: I noticed a significant change around the start of the Iraq war. Most of it I would say is political in nature but some of it, I think, is residual resentment of the younger sibling doing a little bit better than the older one (certainly not now but in the past,) hence, the continued we're more cultured, we're more educated, we have real history, architecture, etc., bullshit arguments that pop up. What I find the most insulting is when people feel so comfortable around you that they forget you're an American and start badmouthing other Americans and/or American culture (or what they've decided is American culture) right in front of you! I feel that it's an inside glance to what people are most often thinking when they're not self-censoring.
The rudeness in customer service is fairly appalling in some areas and that certainly has left a mark over the years. It starts to add up after 10 years of lengthy travel to London for both business and pleasure. I no longer consider myself a tourist but some Londoners seem to want to go out of their way to make me believe that I am. I've traveled all over Europe, even lived there for five years, and in my experience, London and Paris are seriously bitchy places. Doesn't apply to all citizens of either city but there's certainly been enough of them over the years for me to know that I'll be rolling my eyes more often than not.
This article was pretty ignorant, even by Gawker standards. I'm really no fan of London (just ask my wife who is sick of my bitching after I had to live there for more years than I want to remember) and some of the points raised were even fair (e.g. the pound being stupid-expensive). However, I can't be bothered to correct it all (I could, but I'm just too drunk at the moment) but raising that shithole Brooklyn as a counter-argument is unbelievable (don't bother comparing murder rates). You could do better (E-mail me and I'll tell you things that are relevant and not based on outdated PBS repeats). And NY has baseball?? The US doesn't have the monopoly on boring sports, think of cricket! And what about that travesty you call football? I'm going to stop now, I'm pretty irate and I'm going to have another drink to calm down (a gin sour, an American invention but you'd probably not know that).
Look, I think New York is great, but I think it has too many lazy parents (FFS 7 year olds in strollers?) and too many selfish people owning dogs who can't be happy living alone in those small NY apartments (FFS, I'm so sick of dog's barking and the smell of their piss in the morning).
I moved from NYC to London and back to NYC in the past 3+ years. My biggest takeaway: nothing in London fucking works.
The subways don't just stop running at midnight(ish): they stop wherever the hell they are in the system, and kick you out, and you're in Islington and need to get back to Hoxton, and you're fucked.
It's New Years day, about 3pm, and you've crawled out of bed to find something to cure your hangover, but every fucking restaurant/cafe/coffee shop/market is closed, so you have to drag yourself to the McDonald's (of course) in Liverpool St. station because it's the only open establishment within five miles, except that apparently the clubs are apparently still open, because there are drunk chicks being dragged shoeless out of them, and other drunk chicks waiting in line to get in them, at 3:00PM.
The tube isn't air conditioned.
Nothing else is air conditioned, either; you can't get A/C in your apartment no matter what. And every summer it goes up to 90 degrees (sorry - 35), and everyone is stunned, like it's the first time it's _ever_ happened, but IT HAPPENS EVERY FUCKING SUMMER! GET A/C YOU FUCKING ASSHOLES!!! The only thing surprising about the heat in London is that the English are still surprised by it.
Compare: seamlessweb.com vs. deliverance.co.uk.
So finally you're so pissed that you decide to move back to New York, so you need to buy packing boxes, except where do you go? Nobody sells packing boxes. There's no FedEx store, no moving companies you can buy them from, no Kinko's, no Home Depot. I asked my coworker what she did when she needed packing boxes; she said "we just nick 'em from the back of Tesco's."
But they have very nice shaving cream, and bacon sandwiches. So there's that.
@Astigmatism: Are you another one of those Boots shaving cream converts?! It's like some secret underground club.
You can definitely buy packing boxes (I say, looking at my packing boxes). Post-Tube, you take an unlicensed minicab like everybody else! A/C, meh, deal for the two weeks of heat. It's not worth the price of installation.
But the drunks, good point. Shaun of the Dead every single night.
@Astigmatism: The Tubes actually run as far as the ends of the lines when they shut down for the night. This is why you see signs in the stations saying "last train to XXX at 0030" and so on.
New Year's Day is a public holiday here. I'm sure it's equally difficult to find certain things on July 4th and so on in New York.
Foster complains that our bars/clubs close early, and you're complaining that they close late. How can we win?
You can buy a/c units, no problem. We just don't bother, for the most part, because it's not hot enough for long enough to justify the expense. Newer buildings often have a/c built in, especially offices.
And packing boxes? Seriously? You're moaning that you have to identify a new brand/shop at which to buy boxes because you can't see your favourite American shop? Try the Post Office, for one, and I could name a hundred more, no doubt.
The only thing I'll agree with you on is the lack of a/c on the Tube. Absolute killer for 6 months of the year...
@gooneruk: New Year's Day Brunch is actually one of the larger restaurant services of the year; after New Year's Eve, Thanksgiving and Christmas. So yes, you can absolutely get something to eat on a national holiday in New York. Not so in any of the major European burgs I've found myself in during various holidays.
11:46 AM
10:33 AM
10:27 AM
They put the frisson in frisson of violence!
10:39 AM
10:51 AM
10:56 AM
10:00 AM
That said, London seems a city more supportive of the private moment than New York. What is good about New York is evident to everybody: what is good about London you have to discover for yourself.
I feel it would be an excellent place to live while writing, because it's a city that, for all its size, doesn't pose immediate distractions.
10:49 AM
11:12 AM
08:29 AM
Yes, London has crap service and none of the convenience New York has, however it really is a more global city and has some gentle civilities that are usually lost on residents. Forgive me, but the difference between my minicab driver's courtesy on the way to Heathrow yesterday and the asshole cabbie who picked me up at JFK and then yelled at me for giving him a non-cash tip has left me feeling fragile.
08:11 AM
But don't deny your true feelings. All the Jay Z YouTubes in the world can't change the forces of nature.
10:40 AM
11:27 AM
#iactuallyquiteenjoyedboroughma...
tag. I forgot to put the #desperateforalastpost tag and the #thingsicouldgiveashitabout tag. I was sad that St. Johns was closed when I went though. Oh well. New York sucks, London sucks, the only nice place left in the universe is Asheville, North Carolina and The Maldives, which I recently learned I've been pronouncing wrong for the last four years. Whoops.
05:25 AM
Yeah -- every fucking corner in NY looks like every other fucking corner. I can ID my location in London within two seconds, but New York remains a mess of 90 degree angles to me.
Booooooring!
03:23 AM
Not a WEEK, not a fricking WEEK passes without some by-numbers article in the NYT or elsewhere stating that Berlin is hip. These articles are usually written by people who don't even speak German and wouldn't know what the actually scene here is like if it bit them on the arsch. Often the jist of these articles is: "Berlin! It's just like New York with cheap rents! There are artists here! And internet startups!" as though that weren't the case in every bloody major city in the Western world.
I love this city, but it's ludicrous to say it's outstripping New York.
01:52 AM
01:25 AM
12:37 AM
I mean, what was her point? That NYC has lost its edge b/c things actually work here? B/c natives and tourists can both get the most out of the city without being rude to each other? B/c as much as you try to pretend that it's expensive you can still enjoy a very full life without having to spend an arm and leg every night like you would in London? B/c if you were to wake up at 3 am there would always be something you could do and someplace you could go b/c it's literally the CITY THAT NEVER SLEEPS?! B/c our basic amenities are virtually unheard of in your most expensive new construction? Or is it b/c New Yorkers don't even have to try and they'll still always be cooler than you and that's what really pisses you off?
I know to each his own but, seriously, it's really hard to bitch about NYC when it has so much to offer to anyone and everyone. It seems that the edge that she's missing from NY is when you were risking your life each time you stepped outside your door. Who knew there were people out there that actually missed the crime. Sorry that NYC is still the coolest place to live and also the best vacation city in the world. London will never catch up so just get over it.
05:09 AM
The idea that Londoners are in any way jealous of New Yorkers is just stupid. They don't fucking care about New York unless they're coming here for the killer exchange rate before Christmas. London will never "catch up"? London was there before New York, and will be there after New York. (Probably quite literally, what with global warming.)
In conclusion: London's awesome, as are Londoners.
05:46 AM
Calm down. Both cities are pretty amazing and actually very similar. But to tar 8 million people with the same brush is a bit fucking stupid.
07:56 AM
08:39 AM
08:59 AM
As an immigrant, though (I moved to London as a child) I must disagree about Londoners making visitors feel like shit just because they're not from London/UK. London is the most cosmopolitan, welcoming place I've been to in my life. I'm sorry you've had a bad experience, but most of the Londoners I know are cool, intelligent, friendly, creative, worldly and diverse.
But what would I know. I've only lived here for 23 years.
10:03 AM
The rudeness in customer service is fairly appalling in some areas and that certainly has left a mark over the years. It starts to add up after 10 years of lengthy travel to London for both business and pleasure. I no longer consider myself a tourist but some Londoners seem to want to go out of their way to make me believe that I am. I've traveled all over Europe, even lived there for five years, and in my experience, London and Paris are seriously bitchy places. Doesn't apply to all citizens of either city but there's certainly been enough of them over the years for me to know that I'll be rolling my eyes more often than not.
12:13 AM
Look, I think New York is great, but I think it has too many lazy parents (FFS 7 year olds in strollers?) and too many selfish people owning dogs who can't be happy living alone in those small NY apartments (FFS, I'm so sick of dog's barking and the smell of their piss in the morning).
In general, big cities suck.
01:16 AM
Ex...cuse me?
Brooklyn: Stand up.
11/22/09
11/22/09
The subways don't just stop running at midnight(ish): they stop wherever the hell they are in the system, and kick you out, and you're in Islington and need to get back to Hoxton, and you're fucked.
It's New Years day, about 3pm, and you've crawled out of bed to find something to cure your hangover, but every fucking restaurant/cafe/coffee shop/market is closed, so you have to drag yourself to the McDonald's (of course) in Liverpool St. station because it's the only open establishment within five miles, except that apparently the clubs are apparently still open, because there are drunk chicks being dragged shoeless out of them, and other drunk chicks waiting in line to get in them, at 3:00PM.
The tube isn't air conditioned.
Nothing else is air conditioned, either; you can't get A/C in your apartment no matter what. And every summer it goes up to 90 degrees (sorry - 35), and everyone is stunned, like it's the first time it's _ever_ happened, but IT HAPPENS EVERY FUCKING SUMMER! GET A/C YOU FUCKING ASSHOLES!!! The only thing surprising about the heat in London is that the English are still surprised by it.
Compare: seamlessweb.com vs. deliverance.co.uk.
So finally you're so pissed that you decide to move back to New York, so you need to buy packing boxes, except where do you go? Nobody sells packing boxes. There's no FedEx store, no moving companies you can buy them from, no Kinko's, no Home Depot. I asked my coworker what she did when she needed packing boxes; she said "we just nick 'em from the back of Tesco's."
But they have very nice shaving cream, and bacon sandwiches. So there's that.
05:35 AM
You can definitely buy packing boxes (I say, looking at my packing boxes). Post-Tube, you take an unlicensed minicab like everybody else! A/C, meh, deal for the two weeks of heat. It's not worth the price of installation.
But the drunks, good point. Shaun of the Dead every single night.
07:03 AM
New Year's Day is a public holiday here. I'm sure it's equally difficult to find certain things on July 4th and so on in New York.
Foster complains that our bars/clubs close early, and you're complaining that they close late. How can we win?
You can buy a/c units, no problem. We just don't bother, for the most part, because it's not hot enough for long enough to justify the expense. Newer buildings often have a/c built in, especially offices.
And packing boxes? Seriously? You're moaning that you have to identify a new brand/shop at which to buy boxes because you can't see your favourite American shop? Try the Post Office, for one, and I could name a hundred more, no doubt.
The only thing I'll agree with you on is the lack of a/c on the Tube. Absolute killer for 6 months of the year...
07:44 AM
11/22/09