<![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case - Gawker Comments]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case - Gawker Comments]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> Adam,
what's a "complete and utter lie" is that you say employees have never been docked pay for hours that they worked?!!
If someone quits- Ronn has been known to not pay them for that week that they quit always claiming that they "cost the company money by quitting"
I know, because it happend to me when I worked there. People should have the right to quit a job if they're not happy. And EVEN if it does cost the company money by doing so(whatever the hell that means)-if the employee decides to quit, it's ultimately their decision to do so. Upon hiring an employee at 5W you guys should take into consideration that your company is a hell hole and the employee might wise up one day and decide to leave.
I still have nightmares about that place. Worst experience of my life.

You Suck

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> Adam - How dare you say no one has been docked pay for coming in 15 minutes late? do you not remember the e-mails from Ronn "I am not running a kindergarden..." "it's 9:05, where is everyone?" "HR will go around the office to see if you are at your desks and if not you will be docked"

If you bought into your partnership you're an even bigger idiot that I thought

5DubsNoMore

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> Adam is a windbag too. One of the reasons why Ex 5Wers don't go public is that Ronn threatens to sue and why should a person who got burned working for 5W be saddled with legal bills.

And Adam NOW a partner? I wonder what "kind" of partner? Hmmmmmmmm...Wedding in Provincetown?

SkepticOf5W

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> Those of us in PR have all worked with ex 5W staffers who have run screaming from the building after consistent beratement and constant harrasment. They dont go on "the record" because with therapy, they are trying to move on. And avoid a lawsuit. And being called a C**NT. No mention of that in Adam's email.....interesting.....

prego

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> @Maya_Twocents: For your amusement: [www.alleyinsider.com]

Here's the part I love:

From: Adam Handelsman, 5WPR EVP
To: Steve Blinn
Your email to my client is disgusting and I want you [and employee John Chapman] to take notice... I have instructed every one of my staffers (80) to personally target your clients. I will pay them an entire month's fee as a bounty for every client they take from you. I am also personally calling CEO of your clients, and forwarding your BS email around the industry.

This is the same guy who complained about Hamilton Nolan calling 5W's clients? Rich!

Bos'un's Mate

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> @MisterHippity: Thanks for pointing out what was sitting smack in front of my nose. By bad. And my apologies, Mr. Handelsman! I guess Xenu won't be coming for us in his space plane.


Bos'un's Mate

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> @Bos'un's Mate: @MisterHippity: It's honestly not even an issue of whether or not he is a Scientologist. That's just the part that would be funny. I'm really just pointing out that he's using tactics straight from their playbook. He could have learned it from EST, Lifespring, or studying Tom Cruise interviews, for all I know.

Nonetheless: I'm calling him out for using "attack" rather than "defend" tactics - and using name-calling, undermining and attempted intimidation, Art of War-style.

If things don't work out for him at 5W, they've probably got a great spot for him in Dept. 20 at Sea Org.

Maya Twocents

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> @Bos'un's Mate: @Maya_Twocents:
Not the same guy. According to this page, the Scientology guy is only 23 years old:
[myreligion.scientologist.net]

MisterHippity

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> @Maya_Twocents: You're right. There's a 50/50 chance it's the same guy since [preview.ussearch.com] appears to record only two Adam Handelsman across the US (New York & Florida).

Bos'un's Mate

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> @Bos'un's Mate: Since this whole thing is already pretty insane, it would be fun to take it to the Xenu place, I admit, as the attack structure is about the same.

I'm embarassed to admit I know that, but I had some fun last night reading some leaked LRH memos on [www.wikileaks.org]

Prob'ly not the same guy, though. But you're right: yes, it would explain a heckuva lot.

Maya Twocents

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> @Bos'un's Mate: Naw, you're just starting rumors, but it would explain a lot!

lu·bri·cious (adj) (lōō-brĭsh'əs)
   1. Having a slippery or smooth quality
   2. Shifty or tricky.

Bos'un's Mate

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> What the hell!!1!1!!
  [myreligion.scientologist.net]
  [www.truthaboutscientology.com]

Is 5W handling PR for the Scientologists?

And why is 5W named for a winter weight motor oil?

Bos'un's Mate

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> Would anyone like to speculate on what "5WPR" actually stands for, in this or any parallel universe?

famousauthor

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> @BettyCrocker: Thank you. I just snorted cheap red wine out my nose and now it burns. And there's wine on my coffee table.

It was worth it for that visual.

IvyLeagueMetalhead

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> I still laugh thinking about the 5W email that forbid all future "birthday celebrations from the premises."

Moral builders they are.

pr_slow

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> There is no way Adam Handelsman wrote that; the sentence structure is too good.

Grammar-C

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> Related to MisterHippity's comments - I actually interviewed at 5WPR a while back, and I remember being told "we eat the media for breakfast." Clearly, that was a huge turnof for me, and I'm in a much better place that actually thinks strategically and isn't a calling center.

Personal rant aside, any PR professional should know that an industry reporter can contact their clients directly...maybe you don't prefer it, but they can. If the PR professional is worth their fee, and asserting their thought-leadership in the industry, one would hope that their client relationships are deep enough that they would offer interviews with a portion of their client roster to begin with. Besides, what client wouldn't appreciate some additional exposure?

Sonadelite

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> @MisterHippity: totally. Veeery suspicious.

Great work here Hamilton! Of all the spectacular self-destructions we have enjoyed in New York this week, this is one of my favorites.

crookedE

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> meh.

Sigerson

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> [www.holmesreport.com]

The industry standard makes no mention of 5WPR.

daberkman

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> Re: The Holmes Report: It is the industry standard. And he does have a list of the top PR agency firms to work for.
[www.holmesreport.com]
Guess who's not in it?
that's right. The used car dealership of PR firms, 5WPR.

daberkman

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> The reason former 5W staffers do not give their names with their tips is out of fear of being sued, something Ronn is known for - suing former employees. Funny to note that Adam had a nice spin to every COMPLETELY TRUTHFUL statement.

It's a shame 5W has to lie to cover up their bad behavior. How many other reputable PR firms out there have to compose a letter full of lies to cover their asses when former employees voice the truth in a forum where they feel protected from judicial action?

nbridges

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> Helpful hint for Adam: you can't court good press by calling a reporter a "liar."

BadUncle

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> @TheNewBlack: Agreed. I deal with a lot of PR people on a regular basis, and some of them have been helpful, generous, and cheerfully cooperative, even when I'm crazed and on a tight deadline.

I've also dealt with some of the most self-aggrandizing, power-hungry, narcissistic assholes who insert themselves unnecessarily, make vague promises, deliver nothing, and fuck your deadline in half for the simple reason that they can.

I've never personally dealt with 5W, but I have absolutely met similar entities.

Colonel Mustard

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> imagine how well this would read if every time he typed an "s," it came out "sssssss"

katie_a_princess

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> Sorry. Real reporters can contact whoever they goddamn feel like contacting.

Strangefellow

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> More. More. More slap-sies. More promotional spaghetti!

famousauthor

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> I bet Bob Garfield is going to make us all feel guilty in his Ad Age blog after Ronn makes Adam commit suicide for this shitshow.

webothlikesoup

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> @TheNewBlack: "This just highlights everything that is wrong with PR people today: Reporters don't work for you, and they don't need your permission to do anything. If you want to control a reporter, become an editor."

Here here!

While this isn't true of all PR people, it applies to way too many.

AnotherDrinkPlease

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> @hugomania: Like I said, this highlights so much of what is *wrong* with PR folk. There is plenty that is right. Most are perfectly decent and professional. It's the [sic]s of the world that mess it up.

TheNewBlack

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> A little off-topic, but the meta-title for the 5WPR website is "5W Public Relations: PR Agency Of The Year," but for the love of Google I can't figure out who actually named them "PR Agency of the Year."

Oh, also: these Gawker/5w posts are probably a little higher on the GoogSearch than Ronnnnnnn & Co. would prefer.

Tippy and Bad Girl

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> So they tried to block Ham No's access to their clients for a story and then got pissed when Gawker didn't approve their comments to be posted?

Kettle, it's pot on line one...

LatestBy

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> Wow, Hamilton - I'd love to hear more about this dinner. Holy shit. I imagine it'd be similar to a dinner with Scientologists - trying to sell you some line bullshit so bullshitty it is soul-crushing.

Perhaps "F Hamilton Nolan" has been axed or has been ordered to cease her/his postings here. I'm keeping my eye out for that one.

fiveinchtaint

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> there's something very john Fitzgerald pagian about this ham-fisted attempt at a defense

The Dewd

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> Bet Adam's letter was written in crayon.

ExtraMayo

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> @TheNewsBlack: "Seriously, how can you claim to be PR experts when you don't understand the most basic elements of reporting? I AGREE; these guys obviously have no knowledge of the working press or how true journalism works. AND "This just highlights everything that is wrong with PR people today..." I DISAGREE, in part.

5W is just one small agency not a representation of PR firms or professionals worldwide. I've worked in the industry for over 25 years and I have earned a solid reputation with the press for earnest work w/out b.s., providing journalists with the information they want, when they need it. And I'm talking hard news, not planting Page Six items. There's a big difference between public relations and PUBLICITY, of which I believe 5W falls can be labelled the later from the looks of his work this past year. Not once have I ever been told the agency was hired for strategic media planning, blue chip crisis communications, et al... they seem to throw a bunch of promotional spaghetti against the wall hoping something sticks.

hugomania

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> Dear Adam (totally Awesome Jewish Flack):

Thou dost protest too much.

Sincerely,
AveCBoob

P.S.: I shall now refer to everyone by their ethnic/racial/socio-economic statuses, with the modifier "totally awesome" to precede. As per:[gawker.com]

avecboob

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> @TheNewBlack: Seriously!! If I introduce a reporter to a client, from then on I assume they can and should speak freely. Moreover, if I were to traffic and monitor every bit of communication between the two parties it sets an atmosphere where the BS Baraometer would be hopping off the4 charts.

Oh yeah, and all of this crap (no yelling, everyone loves working here, etc) is complete bullshit.

Reggie Cameron

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> @Botswana Meat Commission FC: What's more: 5W KNEW they were being profiled by PRWeek. Why not GIVE the reporter a list of names and clients in which you have a good relationship, both past and present, to said reporter to contact? 5W seems like a bunch of fucking clowns.

richardmarxhatesmyhair

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> Hamilton was assigned to cover Ronn Torossian on a story about self promotion with in the PR industry. Nolan then decided it was his right to start contacting 5W clients for comment. That is and was completely unacceptable behavior from an industry trade reporter, and Ronn refused any additional comment. Let me know which PR firm CEO would stand idly by and let a reporter contact clients without permission.

HA!

Ridiculous.

Did you all leave off the part where he wrote:

And then Nolan took it upon his big bad self to actually call his mother and ask her what she wanted for Mother's Day.

Stark_pigeon

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> Where's the transcript of the phone call between Adam Handelsman's mom and Nick Denton's mom, where Mrs. Handelsman calls Mrs. Denton to let her know that she doesn't appreciate Nicky and his hooligan friends taunting her little Adam?

jack-of-all-trades

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> "...The Holmes Report named 5W one of the best firms in the country to work for."
I had a horrible boss (in a PR Firm) that decided she wanted to be named in one of the many "best palces to work for" surveys. She did this by only handing out the survey to those who were part of her inner circle, the ones who liked her and kissed her butt everyday.
When the article came out, and our firm was listed, more than half the office was confused and angry becuase they weren't given the chance to fill out the survey. PR doesn't have to be evil, but there are certainly evil people in PR.

kathotdog

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> @ragepotato: Funny 'cos it's true.

BettyCrocker

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> That e-mail is more proof that this seems to be the week of self-orchestrated downfall.

thegayrecluse

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> Ok i'm like the 4th person to mention this, but it deserves to be said over and over again.

Ronn and Co: are you listening?

It is incumbent upon any reporter, trade or otherwise, to contact the clients of a company he is profiling. Where you picked up the idea that a reporter needs your permission to call your clients is beyond me. I challenge you to find a single reporter or legitimate PR person who thinks otherwise.

Seriously, how can you claim to be PR experts when you don't understand the most basic elements of reporting? Did you even bother to, I don't know, rent some movies about journalism before you entered this profession? No wonder you get such bad publicity!

This just highlights everything that is wrong with PR people today: Reporters don't work for you, and they don't need your permission to do anything. If you want to control a reporter, become an editor.

TheNewBlack

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> @MisterHippity:
If you're a half-decent pr agency that's confident you do a good job for your clients, why would you be worried about a reporter contacting them? (Unless you secretly know you've been a dick and that your personal rep is in the shitter.)

Botswana Meat Commission FC

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> @BettyCrocker: Three people just asked me to leave a coffee shop because I lost it over your comment. I need mind bleach to get rid of the Batali image.

ragepotato

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> If the jokers at 5W were REMOTELY good at their jobs, then this story would be in the Technology Section of the Times pitched by 5W with clients on board for comment and the story would be "Swimming with Snarks: How to One Business is Fight Back Against Bloggers." It would be written by a writer with whom Ronn had a personal relationship and knows that Ronn is a good guy.

The above is the equivalent of a kindergarten game of slap-sies.

richardmarxhatesmyhair

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> I won't say much since I'm a dummy and smart people (CHOIRE!!!!!!!!!!!) have already remarked on it but... that "his right" business? IS COMPLETELY FUCKING NUTS. OHMYGOD NO BUT NO BUT REALLY NOT EVEN AT ALL NO.

the supergoddess

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> Also, I find it stunning that 5W employs only ONE employee that is not defined as "salaried" for labor-law purposes.

Beyond this one person, a company of this size employs no secretaries or other clerical workers? No mailroom or maintenance people?

Sounds pretty suspicious to me. I think the U.S. Department of Labor should investigate that.

MisterHippity

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> I love it when someone reflexively calls me "jealous" because I fail to swoon with admiration at someone who doesn't deserve it. Newsflash: I don't care what lists he made or who's kissing his ass -- he called an employee a "cunt", told her "fuck you", and gloated about himself and his accomplishments. This is not a person who deserves respect, and certainly not someone of whom to be "jealous".

Also, let it be known that Ronn's emails have left him hoisted on his own petard. If anyone's smearing his credibility, it's himself.

Colonel Mustard

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> I wouldn't be surprised if Roger Stone is a 'client' of theirs.
[gawker.com]

fileunder

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> Is it strange that former and present employees of the firm have not chimed in here on the record? After the unhinged, psychotic, feral pig-attack on a former employee?

Also, when you used the quotes on "unsubstantiated" you inadvertently wrote the only truth of your letter.

ragepotato

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> I have to add - what kind of a PR firm sends out a letter that was so clearly not vetted for grammar and punctuation? The breathless tone is even worse.

This letter is the PR equivalent of Mario Batali standing naked in front of a mirror and saying: "I'd do me!"

BettyCrocker

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> In addition to the conspicuous non-denial of the stupid cunt issue, I also didn't see a rebuttal or acknowledgment of "We are not hiring 5WPR as a direct result of the behavior...

In short, awesome damage control, Ronn. Team Nolan.

Fuck you very much.

karion

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> Also, as a practical matter, isn't this response by Handlesman the very definition of a bad PR move?

He's succeeded only in making himself, and his company, look worse, and has probably exponentially magnified the bad publicity. Many (like me) who were unaware of what Hamilton wrote in first place will probably hear about it now.

MisterHippity

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> And I almost forgot....

About a year and a half ago or so, 5W was hired on a project basisc by a very, very well respected NYC religious institution to run a press conference for an announcement about a poll they conducted.

I worked for another firm hired by this same institution for other PR work.

Not only was 5W unable to get any press whatsover to show up to the presser (which I attended), they had some staff members of this well known institution pose as reporters and asked canned questions so the CEO had something to say and someone to answer.

That's how 5W works.

skifree

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> Sincerely? What happened to "Fuck You Very Much?"

Ummwhat

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> @KarenUhOh: Bingo. No further questions, your honor.

iplaudius

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> I was crestfallen to discover that Handelsman's letter did not end with the closing "Fuck you very much." I'm no PR expert but there's got to be a term or art for missing such a sweet opportunity to win over your target public.

lawyergay

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> ...Nolan is harboring a vendetta armed with "unsubstantiated" and "Anonymous" posters comprised of evidently jealous individuals.

Ah, the old "you're just jealous" defense. Not very original but works every time - if you're in grade school.

Calitri

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> Assigned "management improvement reading"? I'd rather have dinner with Mary Rambin.

ouikant

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> I've been in PR for ten years and have interviewed with Ronn and his lackeys on three different occasions. Once when Ronn was making his name at MWW and twice with 5W.

And what i've learned out of all those experiences is pretty simple....Ronn is a douche.

Thankfully I turned down each offer.

skifree

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> Oh my God Hamilton, you contacted their clients without PERMISSION???!!!

"On an almost hourly basis we read about the monster that is Ronn Torossian and 5W house of horror." Oops, no "air quotes," so at least they're owning up to it.

"Turnover is in fact the opposite as posted." Care to share numbers, Ronnnn?

"There is no yelling and screaming at the firm." Only in our email subject lines. Same goes for the "c" word.

And of course, not signed by Ronnnnnnn. Because he might say the "c" word!

In Other News...

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> Gems!

Nolan then decided it was his right to start contacting 5W clients for comment. That is and was completely unacceptable behavior from an industry trade reporter, and Ronn refused any additional comment. Let me know which PR firm CEO would stand idly by and let a reporter contact clients without permission.

Um, the fact that they are your clients is often public knowledge, and if your clients want to talk to the press about the job you did for them, there's little you can do to stop it. It's like, free speech and free press, and stuff.

Use a Russian accent for this one: The fact that once a month Ronn takes new employees to breakfast is trait that should be mimicked and not frowned up.

EEN Russia, ve frown UP!!!

Just last week, the firm was named the 21st largest independent PR firm in the U.S. and we maintain incredible media relationships, with the exception of this one blogger!

And, apparently, incredible media relations are being maintained with the cunt who, along with her attorney, got screamy typo-filled e-mails that were signed off "fuck you very much".

PR - the game of kings!

BettyCrocker

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> Oh, and were you sick the week they taught "rise above the fray" at Publicist College?

Conbon

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> "Nolan then decided it was his right to start contacting 5W clients for comment. That is and was completely unacceptable behavior from an industry trade reporter..."

That may be the single worst thing I've ever heard from a public relations professional (and that's saying something). It is also utter bullshit and it betrays the twisted operating principle behind how he treats and regards reporters and journalism.

Choire

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> "Ronn, in fact, assigns management improvement reading to his senior staff. The most recent book distributed was "The No Asshole Rule" which discusses how management must be decent."

The previous assignment of "The No Penis Rule" was not as well received. Next week: "The No Cunt Rule".

Lonesome_George

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> Professional liars are good at lying.

Conbon

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> "Nolan then decided it was his right to start contacting 5W clients for comment. That is and was completely unacceptable behavior from an industry trade reporter, and Ronn refused any additional comment. Let me know which PR firm CEO would stand idly by and let a reporter contact clients without permission."

Having worked as an "industry trade reporter" myself, I can honestly say that I've never heard of any code of "acceptable behavior" regarding contacting the customers of an industry company. Also, I see no reason why any reporter should need a company's permission to interview its customers. What sheer and utter bullshit.

A good trade publication should be like any news publication - free to cover whatever story it wants and to contact whomever it wants, unbeholden to any "permission" gained from any company in the industry it covers.

MisterHippity

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> So reporters need permission to contact sources now if they happen to be your client? Yeah, OK.

Botswana Meat Commission FC

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> You....you...vendettarer. I would not trust a reporter who didn't want the skinny from the clients. Didn't see him address the cunt issue. Did I miss it?

belltolls

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> Dear Adam,

It all sounds divine. How do I apply?

vibe-rater

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> Yeah, so you say the place is not a cesspool, and apparently others would disagree. This differs from 95% of American workplaces how?

Here's my question: Did or did not the Boss call a woman a "stupid cunt"? Because really, that solves whatever credibility issues anyone may have.

KarenUhOh

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> Wow. They really said "You're all just jealous!" Classy. Professional. And I know absolutely nothing about this crap because I've been skipping these posts until now.

Kakapo

]]> <![CDATA[5WPR Argues Its Case]]> I see nothing here that disproves the only truly important point: Ronn [sic] Torossian is a smug douchebag.

TheHonJudgeSmails

]]>